Battery light!!?

[BobbyBeamer]

My battery light does not come on when starting. The bulb is good. My alternator does not start working until i kick the gas a bit. Alt shop says the bulb acts as a type of relay...is this true? I really am losing it now. More money so they can tell me i have a bad bulb and thats causing my misery.

Any input thanks ahead!

[Javier]

let me know what you find.

http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=8970

A simple check is, with the engine TURNED OFF (Very important), key in RUN position, ground pin 12 of Diagnostic connector. See link to identify. Light should go on, if not, either unloader relay is damaged as described in above link, coding diode is damaged, fuse F17 is blown, or wiring is damaged.

http://www.unofficialbmw.com/e36/electrical/e36_reset_service_lights.html

Javier

[BobbyBeamer]

let me know what you find.

http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=8970

A simple check is, with the engine TURNED OFF (Very important), key in RUN position, ground pin 12 of Diagnostic connector. See link to identify. Light should go on, if not, either unloader relay is damaged as described in above link, coding diode is damaged, fuse F17 is blown, or wiring is damaged.

http://www.unofficialbmw.com/e36/electrical/e36_reset_service_lights.html

Javier

Most helpful..............I did get the light to come on by grounding 85 or 86b(i know its supposed to be the 86b) in the k61 relay so i'm suspecting the relay is bad...looks original and contacts were dirty as heck so they got cleaned to a shine. That didn't help. (The alt shop guys must be high)
Too bad the other thread guy with this problem never posted the follow up after repair. I bet he got a new relay.
Had to order overnight now have to wait the weekend...worth a shot .
I'll post a follow up.

[Javier]

Uncoupling diode should be bad. Ground pin 12 on Diagnostic connector to check uncoupling diode. Carefull, engine not running.

If grounding 12 also works, you have an issue in your alternator Rotor/Regulator stage.

Javier

Edit: Grounding 85 lights as long as relay is connected. Guess you ground 85 (at socket) and then plug in relay, isn't it?

[BobbyBeamer]

Uncoupling diode should be bad. Ground pin 12 on Diagnostic connector to check uncoupling diode. Carefull, engine not running.

If grounding 12 also works, you have an issue in your alternator Rotor/Regulator stage.

Javier

Edit: Grounding 85 lights as long as relay is connected. Guess you ground 85 (at socket) and then plug in relay, isn't it?

Going by the picture in the first link i guess it was 86b that made it light. The socket has different#'s all together. Looking from the wrong way.

Where is the uncoupling diode located? k161? or another behind the glovebox

[Javier]

Try pin 12 as said, with relay plugged in, if no light, relay K61 diode is opened.

Javier

Edit: 85, 86b ....30 numbers are at relay pins.

[BobbyBeamer]

Try pin 12 as said, with relay plugged in, if no light, relay K61 diode is opened.

Javier

Edit: 85, 86b ....30 numbers are at relay pins.


Ok , with relay plugged in, pin 12 grounded no light.
the exact #'s on my k61 relay are : 85-86 30-87a 87b so now i'm confused as to 86b as you mentioned earlier.
When 85 is grounded out, the battery light in the dash works.
so the diode is opened? is that part of the relay itself. I got my hands on a new relay and thats not it.

my original relay is siemens 6136 1388911 (unloader relay k61)
Supposedly that part was superceded by bosch 0332204401 (now called switchover relay) set up same way but w/o the two notches that clip into the socket notches(no biggy there).

Is somebody trying to pull a quick one on me?

[Javier]

Does it match the diagram in picture below?

http://www.bimmer.info/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=727&stc=1

Yes the diode is inside the relay from relay pin 85b (in picture seems 86b but I guess it is 85b to be coherent) to pin 85. When you pull out the relay, grounding socket pin corresponding to pin 85 (or 85a) shouldn't light the pilot, grounding 85b will ground pilot light.

The interesting thing is that unloader relay is a 6 or 9 pins relay, and you listed only 5?

If you have a continuity tester (multimeter) you can check there is a diode between two pins just testing forward and reverse polarity, only one rings the bell.

Some pictures of relay pins should help unerstanding what is going on.

Also is the socked for your relay just like the one below? Pins are 4-85b, 9-85, and 8-86, as you can deduct from the drawing.

You can also check continuity from relay socket pin 9, to Data link connector pin 12. Should ring the bell.

Javier

[BobbyBeamer]

Does it match the diagram in picture below?

http://www.bimmer.info/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=727&stc=1

Yes the diode is inside the relay from relay pin 85b (in picture seems 86b but I guess it is 85b to be coherent) to pin 85. When you pull out the relay, grounding socket pin corresponding to pin 85 (or 85a) shouldn't light the pilot, grounding 85b will ground pilot light.

The interesting thing is that unloader relay is a 6 or 9 pins relay, and you listed only 5?

If you have a continuity tester (multimeter) you can check there is a diode between two pins just testing forward and reverse polarity, only one rings the bell.

Some pictures of relay pins should help unerstanding what is going on.

Also is the socked for your relay just like the one below? Pins are 4-85b, 9-85, and 8-86, as you can deduct from the drawing.

You can also check continuity from relay socket pin 9, to Data link connector pin 12. Should ring the bell.

Javier

we are talking about a 6 pin relay and that is what it should be. What i have has 5 ...it could be the wrong one.
What is the part# for that relay supposed to be?

[Javier]

as is part number 61 36 1 388 911, it is missing the diode and the extra pin, so there should be no battery light if you use that relay. (Item 4 of this link)

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=HD21&mospid=47383&prod=19920100&btnr=61_0571&hg=61&fg=25

Proper relay is like Item 9 on this link, part number 61 35 8 350 566

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=HD21&mospid=47383&prod=19920100&btnr=61_0565&hg=61&fg=25

Javier

[BobbyBeamer]

as is part number 61 36 1 388 911, it is missing the diode and the extra pin, so there should be no battery light if you use that relay. (Item 4 of this link)

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=HD21&mospid=47383&prod=19920100&btnr=61_0571&hg=61&fg=25

Proper relay is like Item 9 on this link, part number 61 35 8 350 566

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=HD21&mospid=47383&prod=19920100&btnr=61_0565&hg=61&fg=25

Javier

All becoming clear now....I am looking at charging system wiring diagram for 1989 5's ...they have a circuit w/0 the relay (just the bulb) like the older 5's
BUT 90's use a 5 pin relay. My car is a 91........91 and up use 6 pin relay

Production date was 10 or 11 /90 so I bet somewhere down the lane somebody dropped in the relay for the 1990 IF thats even the right one. Cause you know everybody is a pro right!? :p VERY CrAzY stuff

I am hunting the part and will post a follow up.

[Javier]

5 pin relays, 91 up have 6 pin relays (with biasing diode).

Javier

[BobbyBeamer]

5 pin relays, 91 up have 6 pin relays (with biasing diode).

Javier

Solved..........................ended up getting the correct relay locally for about 26.00 (NOT BAD AT ALL) but not from shep boys or autozoned or anything like that, they don't have a clue. Big Thanks on this one.

for future reference of course:
green (or white) 6 pin 12v 10/30Watt (not volt) w/diode
BMW part#6135 8350 566