Whats this!?! A plastic impellor?

[Hallmark]

Last week my 525 turned over 200K miles. I was looking through my maintenance log and thought it was about due for a new water pump. Sure enough, I delayed calling BMA and Wednesday evening I hear a grinding coming from the engine. The water pump is dying and taunting me for waiting a week.

I didn't think I would make it until BMA could get me one, even by 2nd day air. I called the local stealer and with my CCA discount the pain was bearable so I picked up a new water pump yesterday. At the parts counter I asked the guy if the impellor was metal and was assured it was, the plastic ones were long out of the system. As you may have guessed by now, I took a careful look at the new pump and saw that it was plastic. I talked to the service manager who also thought the impellors were metal, but agreed upon checking that the one I had was plastic. He checked the stock and they were all plastic.

The service manager made a few calls and came back to tell me the impellors were all plactic now. He pointed out that other brands have used plastic impellors for years without problems. He is convinced that BMW has done their homework and this new impellor is up to the job. It comes with a 2 year unlimited mileage warranty.

What do you think? Has anyone heard of a new design impellor for BMW water pumps? I took the pump, but I'm keeping my receipt.

[granit_silber]

Last week my 525 turned over 200K miles. I was looking through my maintenance log and thought it was about due for a new water pump. Sure enough, I delayed calling BMA and Wednesday evening I hear a grinding coming from the engine. The water pump is dying and taunting me for waiting a week.

I didn't think I would make it until BMA could get me one, even by 2nd day air. I called the local stealer and with my CCA discount the pain was bearable so I picked up a new water pump yesterday. At the parts counter I asked the guy if the impellor was metal and was assured it was, the plastic ones were long out of the system. As you may have guessed by now, I took a careful look at the new pump and saw that it was plastic. I talked to the service manager who also thought the impellors were metal, but agreed upon checking that the one I had was plastic. He checked the stock and they were all plastic.

The service manager made a few calls and came back to tell me the impellors were all plactic now. He pointed out that other brands have used plastic impellors for years without problems. He is convinced that BMW has done their homework and this new impellor is up to the job. It comes with a 2 year unlimited mileage warranty.

What do you think? Has anyone heard of a new design impellor for BMW water pumps? I took the pump, but I'm keeping my receipt.

I was told that BMW switched to metal impellers, but they failed with bearings seizing up. So they decided that plastic was the way to go.
-ashley

[winfred]

id wait for a aftermarket with a metal impeller personally, but the orignal plastic are good for usually 100k with a few lucky ones barly making it to 200k, my favorite brands are hepu and graf, geba SUCKS damn near every one i've installed or sold has come back with a bad bearing on several different engines not just m50s

[Hallmark]

I don't know the brand, but it came from BMA and had a metal impellor. Getting 100K sounds prety good to me.


id wait for a aftermarket with a metal impeller personally, but the orignal plastic are good for usually 100k with a few lucky ones barly making it to 200k, my favorite brands are hepu and graf, geba SUCKS damn near every one i've installed or sold has come back with a bad bearing on several different engines not just m50s

[Kalevera]

Hey Winfred - even on the m30's? Patrick sold me a Geba for my M30 in February...haven't installed it yet.

[Mobius]

They're now made from a composite material that is reportedly longer-lived than the metal version.

No worries.

[Derek A.]

BMW was switching to a composite material for its water pumps. Its not nylon like round one of the M50 motors, but they are a nice piece. Not sure if the aftermarket has caught up yet - but the OEM BMW piece is nice.

[Kalevera]

hmm...looks like metal to me :/

[winfred]

i can't remember any m30s off of the top of my head that i installed but i don't get that many m30s for water pumps, and i don't run the parts store enough to have a look at the big picture, the factory pumps seem to last forever on those motors. i have had geba's crap on m20s m42s m44s m50s and b230 volvos, it's the same story everytime, the bearing grinds down to nothing and that can be a bitch on m42/44 motors as it can **** the timing cover if ignored (and boy is that fun to replace, you gotta pull the head) i guess they use a shitty grade/brand of bearing, the only way i would install a geba on one of my cars would be if i had no other choice so that i could drive to get another brand back home, the sonofabitch that was on my 325 lasted 38k miles ( i sent it on to it's reward with a 12# sledge after i removed it) that's about 2 years for that car


Hey Winfred - even on the m30's? Patrick sold me a Geba for my M30 in February...haven't installed it yet.

[niall]

that is the same as the x300 jaguars that i work on,
they have plastic impellors in the water pump, they are
absolute disaster, i have changed maybe 3 dozen of them
at 800dollarsAU each!

[Paul_540i]

What pump does the M60 V8 have? Mine works fine at the moment but I have no idea how old it is or if it's ever been changed at all.

[SRR2]

id wait for a aftermarket with a metal impeller personally, but the orignal plastic are good for usually 100k with a few lucky ones barly making it to 200k, my favorite brands are hepu and graf, geba SUCKS damn near every one i've installed or sold has come back with a bad bearing on several different engines not just m50s

Some (most?) retailers list Hepu, Graf and Geba under one part number at the same price -- I suppose the implication is that you'll get one of them but have no choice. At a couple of places they also list "LASO" as an alternative for a couple of bucks more. Anyone know the deal with this brand? I don't mind paying the couple of extra bucks for better materials.

[winfred]

laso is ok just not as common


Some (most?) retailers list Hepu, Graf and Geba under one part number at the same price -- I suppose the implication is that you'll get one of them but have no choice. At a couple of places they also list "LASO" as an alternative for a couple of bucks more. Anyone know the deal with this brand? I don't mind paying the couple of extra bucks for better materials.

[granit_silber]

Just got off the phone with BMA 'cause you guys got me worried about the Geba waterpump I received on friday. They told me that all of the aftermarket pump manufactuers (Hepu, geba, Laso, Graf) all use the same bearings made by the same company and that the Geba and Hepu pumps are the same in quality. Just thought I'd pass it along.
-ashley

[632 Regal]

Paul if your in doubt about the pump replace it! Its part of service along with hoses anyways. Spend a little now or a whole lot later.

[winfred]

ok so it's just by chance that after we stopped selling geba (use to be about all we sold due to low price) the over 50% return rate on water pumps (all with bad bearings) dropped to near zero, the spanish, italian and german manufactures all get their bearings from the same parts bin? i wouldn't hold my breath. disliking geba pumps did come from 3 or 4 pumps or even 20, it comes from damn near every one i installed or sold for somebody else to install for about two years came back to bite me in the ass, it seriously sucks ass doing warranty work as you don't get paid for redoing it and it takes time that you could be doing a paying job. i am not trying to be a dick, it's just a observation


Just got off the phone with BMA 'cause you guys got me worried about the Geba waterpump I received on friday. They told me that all of the aftermarket pump manufactuers (Hepu, geba, Laso, Graf) all use the same bearings made by the same company and that the Geba and Hepu pumps are the same in quality. Just thought I'd pass it along.
-ashley

[granit_silber]

ok so it's just by chance that after we stopped selling geba (use to be about all we sold due to low price) the over 50% return rate on water pumps (all with bad bearings) dropped to near zero, the spanish, italian and german manufactures all get their bearings from the same parts bin? i wouldn't hold my breath.

I was just passing along what I had been told.
-ashley

[niall]

Paul if your in doubt about the pump replace it! Its part of service along with hoses anyways. Spend a little now or a whole lot later.


how much is a water pump new in US?

[granit_silber]

how much is a water pump new in US?

I got mine from BMA for $55. Website lists price as $65 and change. (Aftermarket Pumps)
-ashley

[632 Regal]

if you do the pump get a thermostat at the same time (your right there), dont cheap out here, get a BMW stat. Think about new hoses while your at it and your good to go indefinetly...I did the stat, all hoses, all belts, new BMW blue. Have to find the total.

It was about $300 US for everything, my 530 waterpump was about 100 bucks and all the hoses ran almost $200. the belts were cheap.

[niall]

im used to the jags guys
we change pumps at 800AU each plus 90 for a stat,
thats why i thought it was strange when you said
just change it as part of service!

[Hallmark]

for BMWCCA members. In this case it was $72 plus tax.


how much is a water pump new in US?

[uscharalph]

It's funny I just purchased a HEPU from BMA, but was sent a GEBA. Ives assured me they are both on the same quality level. In fact he said he has yet to have anyone complain about a GEBA.

[winfred]

maybe in the last year or two they stopped building ****, but for about 3 years i got almost every one back that i sold or installed with a trashed bearing


In fact he said he has yet to have anyone complain about a GEBA.

[uscharalph]

Keep my fingers crossed.

[Jeff N.]

Martin and I both had early failures one....


id wait for a aftermarket with a metal impeller personally, but the orignal plastic are good for usually 100k with a few lucky ones barly making it to 200k, my favorite brands are hepu and graf, geba SUCKS damn near every one i've installed or sold has come back with a bad bearing on several different engines not just m50s

[uscharalph]

How early of a failure. I was speaking to someone else on this board that installed a geba last September and has driven 8,500 miles so far on it.

[SRR2]

You know, there's plastic and then there's plastic. If they made that impeller out of glass-filled polysulfone it would outlast any pressed powder or cast metal impeller by an order of magnitude. Polysulfone can be harder than aluminum, has a modulus of elasticity comparable to steel, and can't corrode. It's stable to several hundred degrees F and impervious to damn near every chemical made. I'd take a water pump with an impeller made of that stuff long before I'd take one with a metal impeller.

Do they actually use polysulfone? Dunno.

[bfd]

Some (most?) retailers list Hepu, Graf and Geba under one part number at the same price -- I suppose the implication is that you'll get one of them but have no choice. At a couple of places they also list "LASO" as an alternative for a couple of bucks more. Anyone know the deal with this brand? I don't mind paying the couple of extra bucks for better materials.

The BMW database (www.bmwdatabase.com - go to technical section) discuss several different water pumps and like the one from Laso the best. When I had my water pump replaced on my 90 535i, I ordered a Laso, it had a metal impeller.

[Karl]

I got my replacement water pump from local indie. He had them in stock--with metal impeller.