525 TDS chip - worthwhile?

[Nickhlx]

Assuming I get to solve the starting problem, does the 525TDS (M51) engine benefit from a chip, and if so what does it give and does it make the engine prone to some damage ? I wouldn't be revving it any higher, just hopefully be able to use more midrange torque and better economy when not.
It does seem to be overfuelled at WOT and above about 3500 revs from the visible haze out of the back.
Thanks,
Nick

[BobHarris]

I've just noticed you're a local lad.

All the best

Bob

[632 Regal]

TDS? Turbo diesel?


Assuming I get to solve the starting problem, does the 525TDS (M51) engine benefit from a chip, and if so what does it give and does it make the engine prone to some damage ? I wouldn't be revving it any higher, just hopefully be able to use more midrange torque and better economy when not.
It does seem to be overfuelled at WOT and above about 3500 revs from the visible haze out of the back.
Thanks,
Nick

[Paul in NZ]

apparently yes the deisels really respond to a chip,even the later ones

[Rory535i]

I've been in a few chipped turbo-diesel audi's and bmw's and it really gives them a good kick up the arse. loads more torque too. i say go for it.

[Interceptor]

Assuming I get to solve the starting problem, does the 525TDS (M51) engine benefit from a chip, and if so what does it give and does it make the engine prone to some damage ? I wouldn't be revving it any higher, just hopefully be able to use more midrange torque and better economy when not.
It does seem to be overfuelled at WOT and above about 3500 revs from the visible haze out of the back.
What about oil consumption? Are you sure the haze out of the back is not burnt oil?

As Kai@e34.de said, M51 engines are not very good to start with and they don't last very long (usually 300k before they start to smoke badly) so putting a chip in will only shorten a lifespan of your engine.

If your engine is nearing it's end anyway, go for it, you don't have anything to lose, except maybe a couple of thousand kms :)

If you still wish to go for it, try this link:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Chip-Tuning-BMW-325-525-TDS-Serie-143-PS_W0QQitemZ8005778232QQcategoryZ40182QQssPageName ZWD2VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

They promise 175 HP out of a 2.5l intercooled turbo diesel.

[skr]

don't do it. one of the local BMW club idiots chiped a 99 520, got something like 10 hp more out of it , but after an year it souded like crap, drived like crap, and smoked like old truck. yea, and he bought it new. diesels are very high compression engines and don't react well to chips . if u realy want more power think about the exhaust and turbo. diesel exhausts are highly restrictive so u don't get a lot of noise. but if u don't care about noise, u can get a few more hp out of that.
i don't realy know how the tds reacts to a bigger turbo. i ran a tds turbo on my td( stock is 1.8 bar on td, 2.1 on tds i think) but it failed after allmost an year and i swiched back to stock. it made a slight difference but nothing too impressive. actualy the stock turbo on the td puts out more power at low rpm than the other one.
i got no ideea how's this going to help you, just wanted to say that in my opinion
chip+diesel= trouble

[High Compression II]

Nickhlx,---

What problems do you have with starting your 525TDs?

I have quite a lot of diesel experience, and have just got hold of my first BMW 525TDs

It had a few issues, the seller said it wouldnt go faster than 30, you may have seen a post a week or two ago on that one, Got the car yesterday after being transported back from Scunthorpe bu the AA after the water-pump failed ten mins after I bought it! Fixed it today, Couldnt believe how easy it was to change the WP, Guessed at three hour job, but it was done and dusted within an hour The 30MPH problem --Just a completely blocked fuel filter.--The previous had used what looked and smelled like Kero and waste engine oil as fuel................

Its on nice clean fresh Veggy Oil fuel now, and loving it!--Much more power than that 'Orrible mix the previous had used, and NO smoke at all!

About 'chips', Some types alter the timing parameters which can cause excess wear/tear as well as the fuelling. This type would be great for Veggy oil as fuel, as you need to advance timing for best results anyway, Maybe when I get some spare cash, Ill give one a try........

Need to sort out the suspension bushes/shocks first--clunks and rattles like an old train from the front N/S and when braking!

[bahnstormer]

hey diesels are supposed to smoke!

heheh

that way when u're on the highway and u let loose the loud pedal
ppl know u're about to pass em from the huge black smoke bomb
hehehe

[Interceptor]

that way when u're on the highway and u let loose the loud pedal
ppl know u're about to pass em from the huge black smoke bomb
hehehe
It even makes passing easier because other drivers slow down when they find themselves in a huge cloud of black smoke :)

[Nickhlx]

I've just noticed you're a local lad.

All the best

Bob


Hi Bob,
Where are you then ?
Nick

[Nickhlx]

TDS? Turbo diesel?

Yes - Why, don't you get those ?

The 525 TD puts out about 115 bhp and the TDS about 140 bhp in stock form, here in the UK

Nick

[Nickhlx]

apparently yes the deisels really respond to a chip,even the later ones

Hi Paul,
I know, generally, but what I don't know is if this particular engine is already on its limit and to chip it would likely mean an early death....

My 2001 E39 530D was stock 193 bhp and I chipped it for 3 years until sold and it was at 230 bhp and 370 ft lbs torque, and with improved mpg.

Nick

[Nickhlx]

I've been in a few chipped turbo-diesel audi's and bmw's and it really gives them a good kick up the arse. loads more torque too. i say go for it.

It sure does, but this car is 10 years and 130,000 miles old and I don't know how much reserve the M51 engine/transmission has in it to handle more power and torque - its already the UK TDS spec (140 odd bhp) and there are chips to take it up to 175 bhp, but will it kill it quickly ?

Nick

[Nickhlx]

What about oil consumption? Are you sure the haze out of the back is not burnt oil? Yes, almost certain it's not oil being burnt...

As Kai@e34.de said, M51 engines are not very good to start with and they don't last very long (usually 300k before they start to smoke badly) so putting a chip in will only shorten a lifespan of your engine.

I would only be putting about 25,000 miles on it in the next couple of years...

If your engine is nearing it's end anyway, go for it, you don't have anything to lose, except maybe a couple of thousand kms :)

If you still wish to go for it, try this link:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Chip-Tuning-BMW-325-525-TDS-Serie-143-PS_W0QQitemZ8005778232QQcategoryZ40182QQssPageName ZWD2VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

They promise 175 HP out of a 2.5l intercooled turbo diesel.....

[Nickhlx]

don't do it. one of the local BMW club idiots chiped a 99 520, got something like 10 hp more out of it , but after an year it souded like crap, drived like crap, and smoked like old truck. yea, and he bought it new. diesels are very high compression engines and don't react well to chips . if u realy want more power think about the exhaust and turbo. diesel exhausts are highly restrictive so u don't get a lot of noise. but if u don't care about noise, u can get a few more hp out of that.
i don't realy know how the tds reacts to a bigger turbo. i ran a tds turbo on my td( stock is 1.8 bar on td, 2.1 on tds i think) but it failed after allmost an year and i swiched back to stock. it made a slight difference but nothing too impressive. actualy the stock turbo on the td puts out more power at low rpm than the other one.
i got no ideea how's this going to help you, just wanted to say that in my opinion
chip+diesel= trouble

I can't agree with you here - my last E39 530D was chipped for 3 years without problem and all benefits, and chiptuners would have got a bad name in short time if chipping diesels was a bad idea - not so at all....

Also different engines have different margins left in them - some are low bhp/litre and some a lot higher with the same internals, so obviously they are already more highly stressed to start with so have less margin to play with.

What I don't know with this particular engine is whether it is still well within the recommended limits or already on the limit.
Nick

[Nickhlx]

hey diesels are supposed to smoke!

heheh

that way when u're on the highway and u let loose the loud pedal
ppl know u're about to pass em from the huge black smoke bomb
hehehe

Yes I know ! ! - I gave my mate a good choking the other day when he was following me and I floored it uphill for about a mile at WOT and about 4500 rpm !

Nick

[Interceptor]

I can't agree with you here - my last E39 530D was chipped for 3 years without problem and all benefits, and chiptuners would have got a bad name in short time if chipping diesels was a bad idea - not so at all....

Also different engines have different margins left in them - some are low bhp/litre and some a lot higher with the same internals, so obviously they are already more highly stressed to start with so have less margin to play with.

What I don't know with this particular engine is whether it is still well within the recommended limits or already on the limit.
Nick
http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?postid=88557#poststop

[iainand]

i have a high flow sports airfilter on my TDS and a full stainless de-cat exhaust, that really helps the engine breathe, the turbo spins up much better. still thinking about a chip too, i too worry about how much strain the engine will take from higher boost or altered timing.

[BobHarris]

Hi Bob,
Where are you then ?
Nick

Portchester

All the best

Bob

[Nickhlx]

http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?postid=88557#poststop


OK - Thanks for the link
Nick

[Nickhlx]

Nickhlx,---

What problems do you have with starting your 525TDs?

I have quite a lot of diesel experience, and have just got hold of my first BMW 525TDs

It had a few issues, the seller said it wouldnt go faster than 30, you may have seen a post a week or two ago on that one, Got the car yesterday after being transported back from Scunthorpe bu the AA after the water-pump failed ten mins after I bought it! Fixed it today, Couldnt believe how easy it was to change the WP, Guessed at three hour job, but it was done and dusted within an hour The 30MPH problem --Just a completely blocked fuel filter.--The previous had used what looked and smelled like Kero and waste engine oil as fuel................

Its on nice clean fresh Veggy Oil fuel now, and loving it!--Much more power than that 'Orrible mix the previous had used, and NO smoke at all!

About 'chips', Some types alter the timing parameters which can cause excess wear/tear as well as the fuelling. This type would be great for Veggy oil as fuel, as you need to advance timing for best results anyway, Maybe when I get some spare cash, Ill give one a try........

Need to sort out the suspension bushes/shocks first--clunks and rattles like an old train from the front N/S and when braking!

Hi,
I got mine a few months ago and have done the front suspension bushes / shocks which made a great difference.

The problem I am having is that it is difficult to start - see my top thread for full details - the main dealer says air in the fuel system doesn't matter which I could understand if it was a continuous fuel loop but it isn't and I thing the air that leaks in is being shunted up to the injector pump and can only get out by tiny injection pulses out until it is purged and diesel arrives. What I can't understand is how air gets in without diesel leaking out and where the diesel is going if not back to the tank, but the pump supposedly has a non-return valve within.
Nick

[Nickhlx]

i have a high flow sports airfilter on my TDS and a full stainless de-cat exhaust, that really helps the engine breathe, the turbo spins up much better. still thinking about a chip too, i too worry about how much strain the engine will take from higher boost or altered timing.


I have the same engine and about the same age/miles. I don't think I will be chipping mine - it seems like the engine will not take it for very long - see my chipping thread.

Nick