I got a ticket: to pay or not to pay (attn: Canadians)

[Jay 535i]

I live in Ontario and have an Ontario driver's licence.

Last month I was stopped for speeding in New York State. The cop was nice enough to let me off with only a ticket for failure to use my four-way flashers while stopped roadside.

I pled guilty through the mail and just heard back from them.

The fine is $25, plus a $55 'surcharge'. This is in US dollars.

The letter says that if I don't pay, the Albany court will revoke my license (which I'm pretty sure they can't do to a Canadian).

Should I pay? What are the consequences if I don't?

[peks]

you better pay we need the money to help our poor ;)

[Jay 535i]

you better pay we need the money to help our poor ;)

Ah, go shove it up yer tailpipe. :p

Besides, I need the money myself so I can donate it to the poor. ;)

[peks]

but.. i dont think they would put a warrant out for your arrest for that typ of ticket. read the small print.

[uscharalph]

I live in Ontario and have an Ontario driver's licence.

Last month I was stopped for speeding in New York State. The cop was nice enough to let me off with only a ticket for failure to use my four-way flashers while stopped roadside.

I pled guilty through the mail and just heard back from them.

The fine is $25, plus a $55 'surcharge'. This is in US dollars.

The letter says that if I don't pay, the Albany court will revoke my license (which I'm pretty sure they can't do to a Canadian).

Should I pay? What are the consequences if I don't?
It's $80.00, why risk any consequences over $80.00?

[Jay 535i]

It's $80.00, why risk any consequences over $80.00?

I doubt there are consequences. I'd just as soon hang on to my $80 if there aren't.

[uscharalph]

I doubt there are consequences. I'd just as soon hang on to my $80 if there aren't.
You doubt, but you don't know. And how about the warrant for your arrest in the US?

[Jay 535i]

You doubt, but you don't know.

Well that's why I'm asking! Duh.


And how about the warrant for your arrest in the US?

It says (and I said) that the 'punishment' is having my license revoked, which I think NY cannot do to me. You seriously think I should fear being arrested!?

My only fear is that my plate number will be added to some sort of black list and that travelling through NY will become much more difficult or impossible.

[TheDuke]

You won't be able to get a license in state of NY, till you pay the ticket. You can always send it back and appeal it. I got few tickets myself from different states (about year old), police haven't done anything about them yet, no warrant nothing. They both were much higher fines than yours. I'm sure NY troopers have more important stuff to do. It's all about you consciousness, are you to live as a felon, life on the other side of the line...:),once you cross to the dark side, there is no coming back. Next thing you know you will be on TV in Cops. lol

[Dave M]

I doubt there are consequences. I'd just as soon hang on to my $80 if there aren't.

A little story:

"A friend of mine" driving a Texas plated vehicle through Mobile Alabama at a high rate of speed, was pulled over and almost charged with reckless driving (95 in a 45 or something of the like). The burly southern officer let the skinny, pasty Canadian off with a large ticket (sum not disclosed) which, due to a very busy life and lack of funds, was never paid. "My friend" has not experienced any ill-effects from the encounter , but will not be driving through Alabama prior to rectifying the situation:)

Dave M

[Jay 535i]

You won't be able to get a license in state of NY

Thanks. That's a useful reply, and a punishment I can live with.

Any others?

[Jay 535i]

A little story:

"A friend of mine" driving a Texas plated vehicle through Mobile Alabama at a high rate of speed, was pulled over and almost charged with reckless driving (95 in a 45 or something of the like). The burly southern officer let the skinny, pasty Canadian off with a large ticket (sum not disclosed) which, due to a very busy life and lack of funds, was never paid. "My friend" has not experienced any ill-effects from the encounter , but will not be driving through Alabama prior to rectifying the situation:)

Dave M

That's funny. My brother has the EXACT same story, only in Oklahoma.

I would like to drive in NY again, though.

[Dave M]

That's funny. My brother has the EXACT same story, only in Oklahoma.

I would like to drive in NY again, though.

Yep, NY is a bit more 'useful' than Alabama (to someone in Ontario)

Dave M

[TheDuke]

Well we aren't talking about committing a felony. There is no possible way they will issue a warrant after you. It would be pointless for the cops going thru all the hassle for lousy $80. Probably your insurance will go up a few bucks, and you won't be able to get a license, or register a car in NY as I mentioned before.

[uscharalph]

Well that's why I'm asking! Duh.



It says (and I said) that the 'punishment' is having my license revoked, which I think NY cannot do to me. You seriously think I should fear being arrested!?

My only fear is that my plate number will be added to some sort of black list and that travelling through NY will become much more difficult or impossible.
I never said you had to fear being arrested, It's just if you were ever pulled over again in NY, the bail would be a ton more than $80.00. Duh???? Are we 8?

[TheDuke]

Yep, NY is a bit more 'useful' than Alabama (to someone in Ontario)

Dave M
Cops do not keep track if ticket was paid or not, the RMV is responsible for doing that. They have no way of telling if you paid it, unless your license was suspended. Which state of NY cannot do because it is out of their jurisdiction.

[Jay 535i]

Cops do not keep track if ticket was paid or not, the RMV is responsible for doing that. They have no way of telling if you paid it, unless your license was suspended. Which state of NY cannot do because it is out of their jurisdiction.

That's what I thought. Thanks.

uscharalph, read your original post and tell me how else I should have interpreted it. And if you're not talking about being arrested, then what does bail have to do with it?

[ryan roopnarine]

i say this as a canadian citizen living in the US right now....

the ticket is ********. 4 way flashers? thats probably a direct result of one's ontario plates. if i was REEEAALL hard up for cash i might hold off paying until i could, and then pay it off. if i were a hypothetical canadian citizen living in florida who got a citation for the same thing driving with florida plates in NY, i'd hire a lawyer in NY. I live on spite, and would gladly spend more than 80 USD to give NYS the finger for such asinine ****.

the part that matters to the hypothetical ontario resident:
if you don't recall, the Bush administration indicated last year that after 2006, US/Canadian border crossings would be done by Visa only, the birth certificate/passport as identification (ie a passport without VISA would NOT be acceptable) which has been acceptable since the beginning of time would NOT be accpetable anymore. with this in mind, the only way i WOULDN"T pay the citation is if I (the hypothetical Ontario resident) is if i planned to conduct border crossings at Michigan rather than NY from now on. possibly, in the future, this might not even be enough, because it might be cause for them to deny "one" the visa (if they are centralised enough about it). so if i were a "ontario resident", i might just eat it and be worry free about the whole mess.

[Jay 535i]

i say this as a canadian citizen living in the US right now....

the ticket is ********. 4 way flashers? thats probably a direct result of one's ontario plates. if i was REEEAALL hard up for cash i might hold off paying until i could, and then pay it off. if i were a hypothetical canadian citizen living in florida who got a citation for the same thing driving with florida plates in NY, i'd hire a lawyer in NY. I live on spite, and would gladly spend more than 80 USD to give NYS the finger for such asinine ****.

the part that matters to the hypothetical ontario resident:
if you don't recall, the Bush administration indicated last year that after 2006, US/Canadian border crossings would be done by Visa only, the birth certificate/passport as identification (ie a passport without VISA would NOT be acceptable) which has been acceptable since the beginning of time would NOT be accpetable anymore. with this in mind, the only way i WOULDN"T pay the citation is if I (the hypothetical Ontario resident) is if i planned to conduct border crossings at Michigan rather than NY from now on. possibly, in the future, this might not even be enough, because it might be cause for them to deny "one" the visa (if they are centralised enough about it). so if i were a "ontario resident", i might just eat it and be worry free about the whole mess.

Alright, I'll pay the damn thing just so I don't have to worry about it.

In fairness, the cop gave me a "four-way flasher" ticket for doing 85 in a 55 -- not for failing to use my four-way flashers. I guess I should feel lucky. $80 just seems really steep. If we were talking about $40, well, we wouldn't be talking about it.

[Lennyz525i]

i say this as a canadian citizen living in the US right now....

the part that matters to the hypothetical ontario resident:
if you don't recall, the Bush administration indicated last year that after 2006, US/Canadian border crossings would be done by Visa only, the birth certificate/passport as identification (ie a passport without VISA would NOT be acceptable) which has been acceptable since the beginning of time would NOT be accpetable anymore. with this in mind, the only way i WOULDN"T pay the citation is if I (the hypothetical Ontario resident) is if i planned to conduct border crossings at Michigan rather than NY from now on. possibly, in the future, this might not even be enough, because it might be cause for them to deny "one" the visa (if they are centralised enough about it). so if i were a "ontario resident", i might just eat it and be worry free about the whole mess.

Are you saying that anyone crossing the border into the US from Canada (including Canadian citizens) will need some kind of travel/visitor visa??

Is that only if you're crossing the border on land?

[Lennyz525i]

Oh and to be more on topic. I would just pay the $80 and be safe.

[ryan roopnarine]

Are you saying that anyone crossing the border into the US from Canada (including Canadian citizens) will need some kind of travel/visitor visa??

Is that only if you're crossing the border on land?


yes, my understanding is that there's no nuance to the rule. if you go from the CAN-->US after 2006, and you are a Canadian citizen, you need a visa. this created a bit of an outcry when they first came up with it, because canadian and american citizens have been allowed to cross between the respective borders with a minimum of identification for a very long time now. if your final destination from can-->US is the US, you'd need a visa in lieu of the old method of crossing (ie, just present your birth certificate or unstamped passport). i don't think the means of transportation has any bearing upon it.

[Jay 535i]

yes, my understanding is that there's no nuance to the rule. if you go from the CAN-->US after 2006, you need a visa. if your final destination from can-->US is the US, you'd need a visa in lieu of the old method of crossing (ie, just present your birth certificate or unstamped passport). i don't think the means of transportation has any bearing upon it.

I'd be very interested to learn what this will cost the US in lost tourism dollars. The increased security (not the threat of terrorism) has already made me and my family far less inclined to visit the US. It's just too difficult and unpleasant to face the DHS. My Australian wife gets FINGERPRINTED every time she crosses the border. I'm taking more holidays in my own country now.

I'm not making a judgement, here. Just saying that a tightly-secured border is a disincentive to potential tourists.

[ra_pro]

I live in Ontario and have an Ontario driver's licence.

Last month I was stopped for speeding in New York State. The cop was nice enough to let me off with only a ticket for failure to use my four-way flashers while stopped roadside.

I pled guilty through the mail and just heard back from them.

The fine is $25, plus a $55 'surcharge'. This is in US dollars.

The letter says that if I don't pay, the Albany court will revoke my license (which I'm pretty sure they can't do to a Canadian).

Should I pay? What are the consequences if I don't?

I have heard from a trucker friend that the consequences might be quite dire if you don't pay. If they catch you again in NY they may put you in jail for a few days. Eventually they may also put your name on a list and not allow in the US at all. I have heard these things years ago and I am vouching that they are true but you may consider whehter it would be worth it.

[Lennyz525i]

yes, my understanding is that there's no nuance to the rule. if you go from the CAN-->US after 2006, and you are a Canadian citizen, you need a visa. this created a bit of an outcry when they first came up with it, because canadian and american citizens have been allowed to cross between the respective borders with a minimum of identification for a very long time now. if your final destination from can-->US is the US, you'd need a visa in lieu of the old method of crossing (ie, just present your birth certificate or unstamped passport). i don't think the means of transportation has any bearing upon it.

Actually, I did some research quickly. I read that you won't need a visa after 2006 when crossing the Canada > US border but a valid passport. Apparently, up until december 2006 you will only need a valid ID, not necessarily a passport. I'm not 100% sure about this either yet, just did some quick google searching about this.

If it's true that Canadians will need a visa to travel to the US by ground in the future you might as well quit NAFTA.

[Jay 535i]

If it's true that Canadians will need a visa to travel to the US by ground in the future you might as well quit NAFTA.

Yeah. So much for the "world's longest undefended border". It'll soon rival the 38th parallel.

[winfred]

$80 i wish, a speeding fine here in loserana is $115 for 1-25 mph over, i think it goes up exponentially over 25 mph. i don't see it being a problem if you never get stopped for anything but would probably be pretty nasty a few years down the road at a traffic stop if it popped up on the computer


Alright, I'll pay the damn thing just so I don't have to worry about it.

In fairness, the cop gave me a "four-way flasher" ticket for doing 85 in a 55 -- not for failing to use my four-way flashers. I guess I should feel lucky. $80 just seems really steep. If we were talking about $40, well, we wouldn't be talking about it.

[Traian]

Lennyz525i, you are correct. Passports are going to be mandatory for getting into the US from Canada. Still too bad though, it would be nice to have a really open high-speed border EU-style (make it easier for me to sell my Cohibas too hahah :))

[Black 535i]

...and that is that there is reciprocity between provinces and states that abut each other and for Canadians as far south as Georgia and Florida due to the frequency of us visiting there. They cannot issue a warrant bur waht they will do is send this ticket notification to the ministry in Ontario and let them deal with it. You may not ever have to pay for it but if caught again there you could have some issues. The other thing is that this all shows up on your driving abstact through the M.O.T. and it will affect your insurance rates and ability to register you plates. Just something to think about. Whatever you try, let us know and keep us informed as a litmus test of sorts.


I live in Ontario and have an Ontario driver's licence.

Last month I was stopped for speeding in New York State. The cop was nice enough to let me off with only a ticket for failure to use my four-way flashers while stopped roadside.

I pled guilty through the mail and just heard back from them.

The fine is $25, plus a $55 'surcharge'. This is in US dollars.

The letter says that if I don't pay, the Albany court will revoke my license (which I'm pretty sure they can't do to a Canadian).

Should I pay? What are the consequences if I don't?

[632 Regal]

send them a $20.00 money order and be done with it, if you get pulled over you did pay and as far as you can remember you paid it all and it wasnt recorded as so, keep the 20.00 receipt with your license to sho any officer or court, the rest of the receipts are at home in a safe.... or dont drive in NY again. Thats a pin ass ticket anyways but we dont know the whole story anyways :D

[uscharalph]

That's what I thought. Thanks.

uscharalph, read your original post and tell me how else I should have interpreted it. And if you're not talking about being arrested, then what does bail have to do with it?
The bail amount is the amount tacked on when you don't pay a ticket or appear. It usually is sizeable.

[uscharalph]

Cops do not keep track if ticket was paid or not, the RMV is responsible for doing that. They have no way of telling if you paid it, unless your license was suspended. Which state of NY cannot do because it is out of their jurisdiction.
But they do keep track if a ticket goes to warrant.

[Dave M]

this all shows up on your driving abstact through the M.O.T. and it will affect your insurance rates and ability to register you plates.

I don't think the depute in Mobile licked the stamp, cuz MTO (ontario) never caught wind of my 'little speeding ticket'. I made a point of requesting an abstract to verify, and she came up clean.

When I'm in the area next, I'll let Bill Clinton do the driving,

Dave M

[Gayle]

send them a $20.00 money order and be done with it, if you get pulled over you did pay and as far as you can remember you paid it all and it wasnt recorded as so, keep the 20.00 receipt with your license to sho any officer or court, the rest of the receipts are at home in a safe.... or dont drive in NY again. Thats a pin ass ticket anyways but we dont know the whole story anyways :D


I think this is the best suggestion so far.

Every state here has its own way of doing things and with increasing computerization information tends to be more accessable. You could be in a routine traffic check and have it come up as an unpaid ticket. They use stuff like that as an excuse to hold people they suspect of bigger crap that they don't want to charge. For $20 bucks you are covered. In a variety of bills, most of the time people will let late charges and processing fees go if you pay the primary charge.

[Qube]

New York and Ontario have an agreement regarding tickets. You'd better pay it off.

[632 Regal]

NY is close to Toronto, Toronto is legal in prostitution if you dont ask for it, id pay the 20 bux and do the hooker man.

[SharkmanBMW]

...and that is that there is reciprocity between provinces and states that abut each other and for Canadians as far south as Georgia and Florida due to the frequency of us visiting there. They cannot issue a warrant bur waht they will do is send this ticket notification to the ministry in Ontario and let them deal with it. You may not ever have to pay for it but if caught again there you could have some issues. The other thing is that this all shows up on your driving abstact through the M.O.T. and it will affect your insurance rates and ability to register you plates. Just something to think about. Whatever you try, let us know and keep us informed as a litmus test of sorts.


exactly...
certain east coast states and Quebec and ontario have a deal where they share the info and it will be held against you at renewal time, and don't get caught there again if you don't pay, the cop may see it as running from the law and you may see a cell even if it is for hours!

[John in CT]

you will lose you right to drive in NY if you don't pay. Computers have looooong memories....

[mattyb]

pay them 81 dollars by cheque and see if u get your 1 dollar refunded. maybe not. dont say anything for 40 years send a very low profile request for your $1 every year. in 40 years time give it to a lawyer and with the standard compound interest as calculated by the courts of your land to measure back compensation, you might be rich guy. i reckon worth $1 just to see!

[Black 535i]

Check out the article for all the legal aspects of not paying in the Toronto Star.


I live in Ontario and have an Ontario driver's licence.

Last month I was stopped for speeding in New York State. The cop was nice enough to let me off with only a ticket for failure to use my four-way flashers while stopped roadside.

I pled guilty through the mail and just heard back from them.

The fine is $25, plus a $55 'surcharge'. This is in US dollars.

The letter says that if I don't pay, the Albany court will revoke my license (which I'm pretty sure they can't do to a Canadian).

Should I pay? What are the consequences if I don't?

[zuzuk212]

It will be refunded ... they are not that stupid.

[SharkmanBMW]

Check out the article for all the legal aspects of not paying in the Toronto Star.


can someone scan that and post it, or a link maybe?
Thanks

[Jay 535i]

can someone scan that and post it, or a link maybe?
Thanks

Yes, please. Or else just give us the gist of it.

[Jon K]

but.. i dont think they would put a warrant out for your arrest for that typ of ticket. read the small print.
Typically any unpaid state driving violations result in a warrant for arrest.

[callen]

If you ever plan on ever possibly going to NY in future pay the ticket......this is a no brainer....