1990 M5

[ringle]

HELP......
Can anyone give me some advice or info on purchasing a '90 M5 Euro spec.....
I've got one located and need to know what to look for before buying it! :(
Any advice would be greatly appreciated!!

[Gayle]

Help us help you. Tell us where you are, where the car is, and what you know about it. How many miles, price, known problems, how you found it. If it is on Craigs list or something like that post the link. Tell us if you have ever owned a BMW before and what your mechanical skills are.


Here is an e34 buying guide but it does not address M5s

e34 buying guide (http://www.bmw4life.com/buyingE34.htm)

What will break (http://www.bmwe34.net/e34main/trouble/what_will_break.htm)

m5 have a lot more stuff to break and it is more expensive to repair. One new board member bought a fabulous m5 recently only to have it blow the head gasket the first week. No matter how great the car is, make sure you have reserve $ in case of the worst.

dcr's 90 m5 (http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=15124&page=1&pp=10)

You will want to get a car fax on it. If you post the vin # someone here can probably run it for you.

You will want to get it inspected.

International Assoc of Independent BMW Service Professionals (http://www.iaibmvsp.org/)

[ringle]

What is Craig's list???

[ringle]

Thanxs for the info Gayle.

The car I'm looking at is a 1990 M5 in Toronto. (Any mechanics in Toronto who I could take the car to for an inspection???) It has approx. 155,000 Km on it and looks as if it just rolled off the showroom floor. I'm a little concerned about the costs of maintenance and repairs so if there are any E34 M5 owners out there that can fill me in on what to expect, please let me know before i get in over my head.

Thanks

[ringle]

As a side note.....Toronto seems to home to quite a few E34 M5's. As well I know of at least two of the very rare (total of 32 built) Canadian Spec M540's that are currently for sale if anyone is interested.

[Traian]

Are you looking at that $10K M5 in the Trader with the Azev wheels? Saw it too, pretty cheap money...

[Gayle]

I'm a little concerned about the costs of maintenance and repairs so if there are any E34 M5 owners out there that can fill me in on what to expect, please let me know before i get in over my head.

Thanks


Maybe there are more, but I can only think of 2 M5 owners on this board. The mechanics can probably tell you what to expect.

If the M5 doesn't work out, you might take a second consideration of the 540s. I seem to remember some pretty favorable comments about them in recent threads.

Good luck.

[Paul in NZ]

if you are concerned about maintenance and running costs i would suggest an M5 aint for you.....get the M540 There are specific M5 boards....

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

From my experience running an M5 for the last 5 years, repair costs vary greatly depending on how good the car is to begin. All of the repairs I've made in this time are common to other E34s and with the exception of slightly more expensive parts the cost has been reasonable. The car has not proven finicky in any way and I use it as a daily driver. (edit: said used, meant use)

Get a cylinder leak-down and compression test before buying. Join the Yahoo E34 M5 group and search the archives there for more info.

For the record, the M5 is an absolute pig on gas. My OBC lies that I get 15L/100km but I only get ~400km/tank in town. Of course, whenever the tach passes 6500 and you're pinned in the seat, all memories of the consumption costs vanish. :D

[Springfield1952]

I use www.m5board.com for my M5 message board. There is qiute a bit of information there if you search around. The board is more Euro centered that North American.

In addition to Anthony's suggestions, the self leveling suspension is a problem. Take a look at the rear shocks, if they leak enough to blow fluid back onto the fender liner they are probably shot. A little leaking is ok according to BMW.

And yes, the gas mileage is terrible but ohh so much fun.

Curt.

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

I use www.m5board.com for my M5 message board. There is qiute a bit of information there if you search around. The board is more Euro centered that North American.

In addition to Anthony's suggestions, the self leveling suspension is a problem. Take a look at the rear shocks, if they leak enough to blow fluid back onto the fender liner they are probably shot. A little leaking is ok according to BMW.

And yes, the gas mileage is terrible but ohh so much fun.

Curt.


Leaking SLS dampers can be caused by bad accumulators (bombs) due to sudden pressure spikes in the system from bump impact. A symptom of bad bombs is a harsh/jiggly/un-compliant rear suspension. I'll be installing new bombs in the spring.

[ringle]

That's for all help and advice from everyone.

After all of this I do not own an M5 ......even after my offer of full asking price for the car was accepted and i was told by the seller "his word was good and the deal was done"!

Perhaps in hindsight i will see this as a blessing...........it may just be not meant for me to own an M5.

I am now pursuing other cars ......have my sights set on a Jaguar XJR......seems a better car with more power, more luxury, newer, and less expensive.

Thanks again to everyone for the help and happy motoring!!

:p :p :p

[Gayle]

That's for all help and advice from everyone.


I am now pursuing other cars ......have my sights set on a Jaguar XJR......seems a better car with more power, more luxury, newer, and less expensive.

Thanks again to everyone for the help and happy motoring!!

:p :p :p

Poor form to drain our energy and then tell us you are going to buy a jag. May you get what you deserve.

[Paul in NZ]

oops maybe i scared him off.....

[Jose]

Obviously, you don't know what you're getting yourself into. Buying a Jag ??? Better car than the bulletproof M5 S38 ?????

Helloooo, owning a Jag means selling your house to maintain the bloody car.

It'll cost you more than 3 ex-wives with 15 kids ( sorry for the macho talk Gayle ).

If you want to play save, look for another M5 with 3.6 engine (3.8 is very sensitive if not serviced properly) in the right conditions with history and if the compression/leak down tests are ok, no problems should be expected. Change the bearings every 80.000 kms and you're home free. Forget about the Jag. I've got a M5 in maintenance with 450.000 kms on the clock and it still hits the 160mph in a blink of a eye....

[misfortune]

Poor form to drain our energy and then tell us you are going to buy a jag. May you get what you deserve.

Did you read what he said? The seller bailed on him.

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

[QUOTE=Jose] Change the bearings every 80.000 kms and you're home free. QUOTE]

Replace which bearings every 80,000kms, big end? I've never heard about this for the 3.6. I do know the 3.8 has problems with the big end bearings but not the 3.6.

The only preventive mechanical replacement item on the S38B36 is the water pump and that should be done every 100,000km. Of course belts, hoses, coolant, oil, brake fluid replaements are givens.

[Paul in NZ]

Knowledge pursues me, but I am faster

I like that Anthony..:p
you guys have given me new faith in the M5.....I didnt know the 3.8 was "sensitive"Hmmm all of a sudden a 3.6 m5 is perhaps viable for me....or a 94 540iS six speed

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

I like that Anthony..:p
you guys have given me new faith in the M5.....I didnt know the 3.8 was "sensitive"Hmmm all of a sudden a 3.6 m5 is perhaps viable for me....or a 94 540iS six speed

Cheers Paul - I have a poster in my office with the same phrase. It makes manager's eyes roll.

More on the 3.8L bearings:

http://bimmer.roadfly.com/bmw/forums/e34m5/6510845-4.html

[MarkD]

Thanxs for the info Gayle.

The car I'm looking at is a 1990 M5 in Toronto. (Any mechanics in Toronto who I could take the car to for an inspection???) It has approx. 155,000 Km on it and looks as if it just rolled off the showroom floor. I'm a little concerned about the costs of maintenance and repairs so if there are any E34 M5 owners out there that can fill me in on what to expect, please let me know before i get in over my head.

Thanks

I am in Toronto and I own a 1993 M5. I know ALL the good independant BMW garages in Toronto, and can recommend one who can do a pre-purchase inspection.

Keep in mind that you can buy a 10K M5 and it can require major work that will cost you > 10K. ( I know someone who bought a 17K M5 against my advice, and ened up putting 17K more into it)

Any decent M5 in Toronto will cost you 20K, and then be prepared to put in 5K, even on one that looks fantastic.

My telephome number is on my website.

MarkD

[Jose]

Anthony, bearings are a very common weak point on all BMW engines. I´m refering to the conrod bearing not the main ones. We change them on the M engines every 80,000 kms as a precaution because most people don´t recognize the sound of a failing bearing before it´s too late and your crank is shot. Changing bearings when you start hearing a slight audible tick/nock in the bottom end = Too late.

[MarkD]

Did you read what he said? The seller bailed on him.


Sure, but jump to an XJS after looking for an M5?

Those jags are junk.

MarkD

[MarkD]

[QUOTE=Jose] Change the bearings every 80.000 kms and you're home free. QUOTE]

Replace which bearings every 80,000kms, big end? I've never heard about this for the 3.6. I do know the 3.8 has problems with the big end bearings but not the 3.6.

The only preventive mechanical replacement item on the S38B36 is the water pump and that should be done every 100,000km. Of course belts, hoses, coolant, oil, brake fluid replaements are givens.

On the 3.8, bearings tend to die due to detonation.

Another part to chanin on the 3.6's is the timing chain tensioner.

MarkD

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

Anthony, bearings are a very common weak point on all BMW engines. I´m refering to the conrod bearing not the main ones. We change them on the M engines every 80,000 kms as a precaution because most people don´t recognize the sound of a failing bearing before it´s too late and your crank is shot. Changing bearings when you start hearing a slight audible tick/nock in the bottom end = Too late.

As I said, I've never heard of this on the 3.6 despite being a member of various M groups and websites for years. Doesn't mean it doesn't happen - just never heard it before.

Some S38B36 owners on the Yahoo! M5 group are approaching 200,000 miles on un-opened engines. Please send empirical data - case studies or testimonials if you have them rather than blanket statements.

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

On the 3.8, bearings tend to die due to detonation.

Another part to chanin on the 3.6's is the timing chain tensioner.

MarkD

True - I put the S52 tensioner on mine this summer. Didn't notice a difference, but the original one was leaking a bit - it wasn't very tight...

[Jose]

Well Anthony, I'm not here to argue with anyone. If people say their engine have run for 200.000 miles un-opened engines, it's their story. I'm only sharing our experience with these engines. Even the E36 M3 engines need new bearings when close to be hitting the 100.000 kms when driven as their suposed to be . We have 3 engines in the shop with shot cranks due to failing bearins, and none has done over 150.000 km.

Most bearings we replace already have significant wear markings up to the joint section. A clear indication that a renewal is in order.

People trash these cars like their lives depend on it here in Europe and the biggest problem with these cars is lack of maintenance, specially proper oil.

As I said, each to it's own experiences.

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

Well Anthony, I'm not here to argue with anyone. If people say their engine have run for 200.000 miles un-opened engines, it's their story. I'm only sharing our experience with these engines. Even the E36 M3 engines need new bearings when close to be hitting the 100.000 kms when driven as their suposed to be . We have 3 engines in the shop with shot cranks due to failing bearins, and none has done over 150.000 km.

Most bearings we replace already have significant wear markings up to the joint section. A clear indication that a renewal is in order.

People trash these cars like their lives depend on it here in Europe and the biggest problem with these cars is lack of maintenance, specially proper oil.

As I said, each to it's own experiences.

I'm not here to argue either, just stating opinions like everybody else.

Your statement: "people trash these cars like their lives depend on it here in Europe and the biggest problem with these cars is lack of maintenance, specially proper oil." May well be the difference.

Most M5 enthusiasts in North America (at least the ones talking on the boards) are more likely to over maintain their cars and, while driving them quite aggressively, don't flog them. Is "driving them properly" equal to flogging, or just wringing out the last HP on every shift? Paranoia about letting the engine oil hit 70C before opening it up is practically a mantra over here.

[GAM]

and thinking of buying a Canadian car you'll have to go through an import EPA/DOT certification process that costs $$$ and time.



Thanxs for the info Gayle.

The car I'm looking at is a 1990 M5 in Toronto. (Any mechanics in Toronto who I could take the car to for an inspection???) It has approx. 155,000 Km on it and looks as if it just rolled off the showroom floor. I'm a little concerned about the costs of maintenance and repairs so if there are any E34 M5 owners out there that can fill me in on what to expect, please let me know before i get in over my head.

Thanks

[Gayle]

Did you read what he said? The seller bailed on him.


Yes Misfortune, I read what he said. I read a lot of what he said because he was private messaging me in a panic Saturday night when no one else would respond. And what I got out of all that reading was that there are a lot of e34 M5s in Toronto where he is located and there are currently two rare 540s for sale there.

Just because this one got away doesn't mean it was the last e34 M5 on earth. It doesn't mean he was forced to turn to a Jag. and even if it did mean that I still think it was poor form to come back and tell us he plans to get a jag.