Help with an amp selection

[we_call_him_doher]

Ok so here is my problem- When I got my car a couple of months ago, the owner before me had installed an aftermarket head unit, and as soon as I bought it I installed some Pioneer 2-way speakers. Looking back I really wish I had done my homework more on the speakers because it was more an impulse purchase, as the rear speakers were blown out and the Pioneer speakers were cheap.

Anyway, I'm still not really happy with the system, as it sounds pretty good when it is at a resonable volume, but as soon as I try to turn it up the sound gets...choppy and distorted. I'm assuming an aftermarket amp would solve this problem, so I'm looking into different brands but my question is- Which brand did you guys find to be especially clear? Do I need to buy a crossover too? How difficult is it to replace a 1990 535i amp?

I looked through the archives, but the whole thing with the crossover is confusing me. Can I hook up an aftermarket amp with the factory cross-over and have clear sound or do I need to buy a new cross-over? I would really like to do this myself so I am hoping it won't be too difficult

Thanks

[Derek A.]

Do you have crossovers for the pioneer speakers ? Are you using them ?

What kind of budget are you on ?

Derek.-

[pundit]

Was your E34 fitted with premium sound?
ie. Tweeters inside the 'A' pillars, midrange in the dashboard and bass speakers in the front kick panels?
(These factory speakers are very well located for great treble & stereo imaging.) If so, were only the rears replaced with the Pioneers, and is the rest of the factory speaker wiring intact or has it been butchered?

If your factory amp/crossover and wiring is still serviceable then there is a economical way of achieving good sound by using a seperate amp feeding the original factory crossover. A few guys have now done this (including myself) and I can vouch for the improvement. Adding a seperate sub, along with removing the bass frequencies below 100hz from the front speakers will be the icing on the cake.

Look at this thread...
http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=19977&highlight=crossover

Unfortunately too many people often just rip the factory system apart thinking they will improve it by fitting some 6.5"s or 6"x9"s... it doesn't!

Unless you are after ridiculous volume levels or concrete cracking bass then the factory system with an uprated amp and added subwoofer can produce some pretty decent sound. :)

[we_call_him_doher]

Sorry guys I should have provided more information. No I do not have a crossover for the pioneer speakers, I just bought the speakers from circuit city. My budget for the rest of my system is (hopefully) $250 or less. I guess I have the premium sound system in my car because there are tweeters in the A pillars and midrange on the dash, but I'm not sure about the bass speakers in the kickpanels. I replaced both the front speakers and the rears with the pioneers. I had the speakers installed at circuit city, so I don't know if they used the factory wiring or replaced it. I would think they used the factory wiring because I didn't pay anything extra for speaker wires, but I'm not sure. Does anyone else have experience with circuit city installation?

I would really like to use the factory crossover because I would think it would be easier to install(?) and I don't really need a huge loud system, just something that I can turn the volume up on and it won't sound like cr@p. Beside the maximum speaker wattage for the pioneers is 130W so I can't buy a huge amp anyway. Any other thoughts?

[pundit]

Sorry guys I should have provided more information. No I do not have a crossover for the pioneer speakers, I just bought the speakers from circuit city. My budget for the rest of my system is (hopefully) $250 or less. I guess I have the premium sound system in my car because there are tweeters in the A pillars and midrange on the dash, but I'm not sure about the bass speakers in the kickpanels. I replaced both the front speakers and the rears with the pioneers. I had the speakers installed at circuit city, so I don't know if they used the factory wiring or replaced it. I would think they used the factory wiring because I didn't pay anything extra for speaker wires, but I'm not sure. Does anyone else have experience with circuit city installation?

I would really like to use the factory crossover because I would think it would be easier to install(?) and I don't really need a huge loud system, just something that I can turn the volume up on and it won't sound like cr@p. Beside the maximum speaker wattage for the pioneers is 130W so I can't buy a huge amp anyway. Any other thoughts?
I've just edited my last post so maybe you should have another read.
Okay if they used the original wiring and factory amp for the Pioneers then you will only be getting a low frequency feed from the factory amp/crossover so the Pioneer tweeters will be doing jackshit. The Pioneers will already have a built in crossover which will most likely be just a capacitor in series with the tweeter to filter out the low frequencies from the tweeter.


... Beside the maximum speaker wattage for the pioneers is 130W so I can't buy a huge amp anyway...
Don't take too much notice of car sound power ratings... the true power handling is probably closer to 20watts (RMS).

My thoughts would be to ditch the Pioneers completely & get back to square one. Yes, even replace the Pioneers with a pair of original factory speakers from a wrecker (get some kickpanels while you're at it.) Don't try for too much bass out of the factory speakers they will just get boomy and muddy if you do. However they make very good bass/mids.

You will never get decent controlled low frequency (under 50hz) bass from the kick panels no matter what kind of speakers are fitted there. The only way to get decent low end in a car is by using a properly designed and powered bass speaker box.

The original factory 5.25" speakers work very well if they are crossed over to a sub at around 100hz. I'm just running a 4 x 50w (RMS) amp into the factory crossover and even without a sub it is far better than the original system was. The trick is to use the line level preamp outputs if your head unit has them (not the built in amp) to feed the external amp and then feed the output of the external amp into the factory crossover bypassing the factory booster amplifier itself.

However I wouldn't even be too concerned about the rear speakers. Use the factory front speakers for your soundstage and a sub for the low end firing through the ski-hole where the center rear armrest lives.

Contrary to what many 'doof bangers' (http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=21168) may say, the factory system is not bad and can be dramatically improved for resonable cost.

[Dr. evil]

ive been doing car and home audio for a long time now. and it seems to me that every time i look at a system istalled by best buy ect.. it is not a very good instalation, soo if the problem is basicaly distortion.
i don't have any experiance with bmw factoy amp but my thought is that they arn't that great in quality control.
three things
1 the speakers are from walmart and they suck
2 bad wireing
3 bad head unit or amp

[we_call_him_doher]

What would happen if I replaced the front pioneers with a pair of factory speakers but left the pioneers in the back alone? Also I dont have a ski hole so where would you suggest mounting the sub? Should I just get rid of the factory amp completely or should I "gut" it as it says in a couple of the old threads? I guess I don't really understand what "gutting the amp" means.

[632 Regal]

the ski hole can be removed with a hammer and big screwdriver, it has metal tabs that werent completely die cut during manufacture.

[we_call_him_doher]

On mine behind the center rear armrest is just a solid piece of cardboard (?) so I guess all cars dont have the ski hole? I just bought some factory speakers off ebay so I can't wait for them to arrive. I haven't even looked at my bentley manual yet, but how hard is it to hook up the front speakers to the factory wiring? I've never done this before so it will be a learning experience.

Also thanks to everyone for their help especially pundit because I know typing all of that up must have taken time and I really appreciate it man.

[genphreak]

ive been doing car and home audio for a long time now. and it seems to me that every time i look at a system istalled by best buy ect.. it is not a very good instalation, soo if the problem is basicaly distortion.
i don't have any experiance with bmw factoy amp but my thought is that they arn't that great in quality control.
three things
1 the speakers are from walmart and they suck
2 bad wireing
3 bad head unit or ampFactory amps are good quality, just old and a booster design. They deliver (practically) low distortion adn good sonic performance given how they are working and their (small) size. Most of the size of the unit in the left rear quarter panel is actually crossover, only the top-secton is booster amp. The speakers however are excellent just are limited by the amp. The crossover in the amp is the best speaker crossover I have ever seen in a car, and with the speakers is matched to the car's interior beautifully. The wiring is fine also.

The head units are old and need to be replaced as most already are. The factory wiring can be used run to the back where smart people split it up into a 5-channel power amp to drive the factory stuff and a sub. It doesn't cost much to do maybe $250 for the amp and the speakers? The rest is soldering into the crossover. I avoided touching my speakers and am really happy. It sounds incredible. Power and size mean little if poorly impletemented, the stock speakers do a great job if driven properly.

[liquidtiger720]

Seriously...could somebody do a write up and list of what I need to do, etc for this amp mod?


I wouldn't mind spending $250 on a amp and do some soldering...but i dont get what gets connected to what...etc.

[632 Regal]

kinda like a transmission is a big grey mystery box to me too.


Seriously...could somebody do a write up and list of what I need to do, etc for this amp mod?


I wouldn't mind spending $250 on a amp and do some soldering...but i dont get what gets connected to what...etc.

[Dr. evil]

i guess the factory stuff could be good for some peaple but after i blew the front tweeters and the rear mids i had to upgrade to the real stuff.
BUt i the other hand i listen to my music LOUD with bass for days.


they have a small upgade for steros on www.bmwe34.net

[onewhippedpuppy]

Here's a great thread from Derek A documenting his connecting an aftermarket amp to the factory crossover, with pictures.
http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=19977&highlight=factory+amp
To you guys with later model cars, I attempted to do this in my '95 540, and the amp is different that in the thread. It appears to have an active electronic crossover and amp in the same board. I just went back to stock, it's not that bad anyway.

My guess is that Circuit City just stuck the speakers in the kickpanels, nothing else. They're cheap, and you get what you pay for. If so, the Pioneers are just getting the low frequency signals from the crossover. As somebody else said, the tweeters are doing nothing. I would bet that an aftermarket amp, running through the factory crossover, and to the factory speakers will produce a better sound than the Pioneers could, even when properly connected. The mids and highs are in ideal spots for good imaging, with the lows in the kick panels because low frequencies are less directional anyway. It would cost a lot to install a 3-way component system into a car, so why not use the one you have?

As for the back, if it's like my car you have a mid and tweeter back there, so again it depends on which wires they connected to. The wires run through the crossover, so you'll either have high frequencies or mids connected to the Pioneers. If they disconnected the other factory speaker, you'll have very unbalanced, crappy sound back there. Again, you'll probably be better off putting OEM speakers back in. Yank the Pioneers front and back, sell on Ebay to recoup some of the cost. Good luck!

[genphreak]

That's right. If one actually replaces the speakers you have to rip into your factory wiring all over the joint, or run one's own wires. Its a real PITA doing that, especially when the factory wiring does the job so well.

To make it simpler for the less inititiated, here's a circuit diagram I just made describing the upgrade- all that is left to do is to add some pics of the crossover's connectors and the internal Printed Circuit Board connections one has to solder the new amplifiers' output wires to. Derek's great thread shows this at some point, if a little out of focus.

BTW; if yours is not the premium sound system (I think) the main difference is that you are missing the midrange speakers in the dash- or is it the tweeters in the front pillars... one or the other.

The cross-over and wiring might well be identical, although the equalisation module in the booster amp will also be different. That is not a problem though as it is disabled when the booster module is removed.

:) Nick

http://www.bimmer.info/bmw/genphreak2/e34stereoupgrade.gif

[Dr. evil]

you can sell the pioneers to me for a reasonable price

you could also use four 3-way passive crossovers

[genphreak]

you can sell the pioneers to me for a reasonable price

you could also use four 3-way passive crossoversNothing wrong with either of them...

This approach assumes that the factory speakers are working properly. Many of us find them too much trouble to replace- fitting a replacements often means changing sizes or mounting holes (Why BMW couldn't use 165mm speakers or 6x9s like everyone else)... Doh!

Due to this fitment is often not very clean, and if fitment is not 100% the sound is never as good. Also, the enclosures that encompass the speakers in the car have a tuned volume ideal to the driver's size (5.25"). Fitting new speakers of a larger size screws this up as it needs a larger enclosure behind it. Compunding this problem, a lot of speakers sold aftermarket have much larger magnets which further reduce the enclosure's internal size, so increasing driver size is often counter-productive.

If replacing the speakers the only way to improve perfromance is to go with the 5.25" odd Polk splits or perhaps a few other premium brands. JBL do a set as do A/D/S. All these are expensive, require their own crossovers to be installed and hence a big wiring job. Anything else is simply replacing the factory driver with something else that will perhaps perform as good as the factory speakers, but also may not. :) nick

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

That's right. If one actually replaces the speakers you have to rip into your factory wiring all over the joint, or run one's own wires. Its a real PITA doing that, especially when the factory wiring does the job so well.

To make it simpler for the less inititiated, here's a circuit diagram I just made describing the upgrade- all that is left to do is to add some pics of the crossover's connectors and the internal Printed Circuit Board connections one has to solder the new amplifiers' output wires to. Derek's great thread shows this at some point, if a little out of focus.

BTW; if yours is not the premium sound system (I think) the main difference is that you are missing the midrange speakers in the dash- or is it the tweeters in the front pillars... one or the other.

The cross-over and wiring might well be identical, although the equalisation module in the booster amp will also be different. That is not a problem though as it is disabled when the booster module is removed.

:) Nick



Pictures here, use any you like.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v11/interalian/stereo%20stuff/

[pundit]

Nothing wrong with either of them...

This approach assumes that the factory speakers are working properly. Many of us find them too much trouble to replace- fitting a replacements often means changing sizes or mounting holes (Why BMW couldn't use 165mm speakers or 6x9s like everyone else)... Doh!

Due to this fitment is often not very clean, and if fitment is not 100% the sound is never as good. Also, the enclosures that encompass the speakers in the car have a tuned volume ideal to the driver's size (5.25"). Fitting new speakers of a larger size screws this up as it needs a larger enclosure behind it. Compunding this problem, a lot of speakers sold aftermarket have much larger magnets which further reduce the enclosure's internal size, so increasing driver size is often counter-productive.

If replacing the speakers the only way to improve perfromance is to go with the 5.25" odd Polk splits or perhaps a few other premium brands. JBL do a set as do A/D/S. All these are expensive, require their own crossovers to be installed and hence a big wiring job. Anything else is simply replacing the factory driver with something else that will perhaps perform as good as the factory speakers, but also may not. :) nick
Unless one is going for an all out spare-no-expense system then I think replacing the factory speakers with something else is of minimum benefit.
The exception would be the tweeters which are fairly ordinary when cranked. I've temporarily fitted some Vifa silk domes (pending further mods) and they sound excellent.

As has already been stated, the factory crossover is really pretty good and designed around the speakers already fitted. A decent CD headunit fitted with pre-outs connected to a seperate amp bypassing the stock booster amp and directly feeding the factory crossover is a very big improvement as several of us can now vouch for.

There is a tendency for people to feel they must replace the factory 5.25" speakers with 6.5" aftermarket speakers... often even 2 ways or 3ways?!!
The reality is this is often a misconception fueled by having little understanding of the existing system or just accepting that a 6.5" 3 way just has to be better than some shitty factory 5.25" that doesn't have a bunch of chrome plated mids and tweeters stuck on the front of it and a sticker on the back stating "300WATTS!!!"
Well in most cases it's not better... it's likely to be worse!!

Even replacing the factory 5.25" by fitting a quality component type split 5.25" mid-bass will be of limited benefit if that is all that is done.
In fact as it probably won't match the factory crossover characteristics and you still could wind up with a worse result than by sticking with the factory 5.25"

The premimum sound stock speaker locations (mids/tweeters) are exceptionally good for stereo imaging. Why someone would want to rip them to bits and then stick a 6.5" 3way down in the kickpanels thinking they're going to get a better sound is beyond me!

A friend of mine has a Mercedes ML320 AWD. His wasn't fitted with premimum sound (ie no mids or tweeters at dash level) but he replaced the factory speakers fitted in the doors with 'Kicker' 6,5" 3ways and a 'Kicker' 12" sub and 100watt amp in the back. He kept asking me to come around and hear it. Well I did just that on Monday. But first he wanted to hear my system (stock speakers, Sony HU, 4 x 50watt RMS amp feeding factory crossover and NO sub). Well I put on Diana Krall's 'The Girl in the Other Room' he didn't say a thing. In fact he was unusually quiet. We then got into his Mercedes and put the same disc on. Well... it sounded like shite and he knew it. All the high end was lost down at floor level and even having the 'ooh, aah!' factor of a sub couldn't compensate up for any of that. Adjusting the EQ just altered the amount of shitiness.

BMW's factory speaker locations are VERY good... SO DON'T CHANGE 'EM!!

If one is trying to improve the systems bass response simply by substituting the standard 5.25" speakers with a 6.5" speaker or something bigger then consider this. There is a lot more to achieving a decent bass response than simply making a bigger hole and shoving in a bigger speaker. If that was the case why don'y we all drive round with 15" 1000watt bass speakers mounted in our doors?.... Because even if you could make them fit, they would sound like total crap, that's why.

Decent bass requires a speaker that reproduces frequencies down to at least 40hz (flat) or lower in a correctly designed enclosure. This enclosure must be solidly constructed so as to reduce resonances and be of the correct volume and tuning (if ported) to suit the bass speaker fitted in order to obtain the best results. So how does one obtain clean accurate sub 40hz bass out of a 6.5" speaker stuck to a piece of plastic down in a footwell with a leaky enclosure of unknown, and most probably incalculable volume???.... well in nutshell... you don't! Not unless you want to spend a bunch on custom designed, tuned reinforced footwell housings that will dramatically alter the interior and day to day functionality of your car.

Now many will say that they are going to fit a subwoofer as well. Well in that case you really DON'T NEED anything else other than the factory 5.25" in the stock locations. While the factory speakers really begin to struggle below 80hz, if you take out everything under 100hz or 120hz with an electronic crossover (built into most aftermarket car amps & many head units) and let a sub take care of those frequencies, then they make quite excellent bass/mids. In fact the entire sound is better with LESS BASS (NOT MORE!) eminating from the from the footwells as any nasty resonances are far less objectionable.

Am I saying they stock system can't be improved by replacing some or all of the factory speakers with something better, of course I'm not.
But, as Genphreak has already said, the system has to be completely redesigned to suit. Crossovers, wiring, amps etc, etc. and how much effort and expense will be involved?
Many here state they are on a limited budget, so that's a big reason not to rip apart the exisiting system.
If someone has a big budget and want's to go the 'whole hog' then get professional advice from an experienced installer.
Don't just spend a bunch at an Autobarn car sound sale, buy 4 slabs of V.B. and invite a bunch of mates around for the weekend while you screw your sound & devalue your ride!

[derick]

well i was looking at the process he used for gutting the stock amp and soldering on the new leads but the pictures in the link are not very clear. can anyone tell me where exactly i need to solder to get the conections right?

thanks

[genphreak]

Haha, well said Pundit... today I was cranking it a bit coming home. Then I heard some scrape-scrape-scrattling in the bass... and suspected the factory speakers had gone given the volume I was running. A careful listen revealed the 12" sub was making the noise.

This is a burnt coil, scraping inside the magnet.

Brand new, but I guess it had been running too long against the carpet in the trunk with too small a gap.

Damn. Still the driver cost all of AU$12 so what can I expect... time to get a new one now... (I tell you what tho, I am sure glad it wasn't a factory driver!) It'd cost heaps more + more time and hassle to fix... :) Nick

[Anthony (M5 in Calgary)]

Unless one is going for an all out spare-no-expense system then I think replacing the factory speakers with something else is of minimum benefit.
The exception would be the tweeters which are fairly ordinary when cranked. I've temporarily fitted some Vifa silk domes (pending further mods) and they sound excellent.

As has already been stated, the factory crossover is really pretty good and designed around the speakers already fitted. A decent CD headunit fitted with pre-outs connected to a seperate amp bypassing the stock booster amp and directly feeding the factory crossover is a very big improvement as several of us can now vouch for.

There is a tendency for people to feel they must replace the factory 5.25" speakers with 6.5" aftermarket speakers... often even 2 ways or 3ways?!!
The reality is this is often a misconception fueled by having little understanding of the existing system or just accepting that a 6.5" 3 way just has to be better than some shitty factory 5.25" that doesn't have a bunch of chrome plated mids and tweeters stuck on the front of it and a sticker on the back stating "300WATTS!!!"
Well in most cases it's not better... it's likely to be worse!!

Even replacing the factory 5.25" by fitting a quality component type split 5.25" mid-bass will be of limited benefit if that is all that is done.
In fact as it probably won't match the factory crossover characteristics and you still could wind up with a worse result than by sticking with the factory 5.25"

The premimum sound stock speaker locations (mids/tweeters) are exceptionally good for stereo imaging. Why someone would want to rip them to bits and then stick a 6.5" 3way down in the kickpanels thinking they're going to get a better sound is beyond me!

A friend of mine has a Mercedes ML320 AWD. His wasn't fitted with premimum sound (ie no mids or tweeters at dash level) but he replaced the factory speakers fitted in the doors with 'Kicker' 6,5" 3ways and a 'Kicker' 12" sub and 100watt amp in the back. He kept asking me to come around and hear it. Well I did just that on Monday. But first he wanted to hear my system (stock speakers, Sony HU, 4 x 50watt RMS amp feeding factory crossover and NO sub). Well I put on Diana Krall's 'The Girl in the Other Room' he didn't say a thing. In fact he was unusually quiet. We then got into his Mercedes and put the same disc on. Well... it sounded like shite and he knew it. All the high end was lost down at floor level and even having the 'ooh, aah!' factor of a sub couldn't compensate up for any of that. Adjusting the EQ just altered the amount of shitiness.

BMW's factory speaker locations are VERY good... SO DON'T CHANGE 'EM!!

If one is trying to improve the systems bass response simply by substituting the standard 5.25" speakers with a 6.5" speaker or something bigger then consider this. There is a lot more to achieving a decent bass response than simply making a bigger hole and shoving in a bigger speaker. If that was the case why don'y we all drive round with 15" 1000watt bass speakers mounted in our doors?.... Because even if you could make them fit, they would sound like total crap, that's why.

Decent bass requires a speaker that reproduces frequencies down to at least 40hz (flat) or lower in a correctly designed enclosure. This enclosure must be solidly constructed so as to reduce resonances and be of the correct volume and tuning (if ported) to suit the bass speaker fitted in order to obtain the best results. So how does one obtain clean accurate sub 40hz bass out of a 6.5" speaker stuck to a piece of plastic down in a footwell with a leaky enclosure of unknown, and most probably incalculable volume???.... well in nutshell... you don't! Not unless you want to spend a bunch on custom designed, tuned reinforced footwell housings that will dramatically alter the interior and day to day functionality of your car.

Now many will say that they are going to fit a subwoofer as well. Well in that case you really DON'T NEED anything else other than the factory 5.25" in the stock locations. While the factory speakers really begin to struggle below 80hz, if you take out everything under 100hz or 120hz with an electronic crossover (built into most aftermarket car amps & many head units) and let a sub take care of those frequencies, then they make quite excellent bass/mids. In fact the entire sound is better with LESS BASS (NOT MORE!) eminating from the from the footwells as any nasty resonances are far less objectionable.

Am I saying they stock system can't be improved by replacing some or all of the factory speakers with something better, of course I'm not.
But, as Genphreak has already said, the system has to be completely redesigned to suit. Crossovers, wiring, amps etc, etc. and how much effort and expense will be involved?
Many here state they are on a limited budget, so that's a big reason not to rip apart the exisiting system.
If someone has a big budget and want's to go the 'whole hog' then get professional advice from an experienced installer.
Don't just spend a bunch at an Autobarn car sound sale, buy 4 slabs of V.B. and invite a bunch of mates around for the weekend while you screw your sound & devalue your ride!

As I've been saying since I first did this mod on my '90 535... ...in 1998.

One of my co-workers built an IASCA competition level car audio system for the single 50W stereo amp category (didn't win, but placed highly). He was very impressed with the sound of my setup - especially amazed by the low cost for the total system. Nice to hear others coming on board.

[onewhippedpuppy]

If anybody has any revelations regarding the late model amp, I'd love to hear them. Someday I would still like to do this, but the non-removable booster stage would present some challenges. I suppose I could pick up an older amp and gut it, but I would like to utilize the newer crossover if possible.

[we_call_him_doher]

Ok here's another question i just came up with...how do I get the wire running from my headunit line output alllll the way back to my amp? Anyone that had done this do you have any suggestions about where to run the wire? Pictures maybe?

[Tiger]

Doher, for your budget, you need to shop at partsexpress.com. They have P3 16 feet RCA twisted interconnect for $16 and you will need two. This will connect your new headunit from front to your new amp in back.

As for amp, they have Aura (the maker of that bass shaker), for like $100 or so... 4 channels at 75 watt each... should be great enough for you...

You will need a amp kit to bring power to your amp... The ground is attached to any metal chassis... but it must be bare metal so you need to sand a bit or otherwise you will have unwanted noise. 10 gauge is enough or upgrade to 8 gauge kit.


This system is cheap enough for you to do it...

Onewhippedpuppy... you can go this route too and buy 4 passive crossovers to handle the factory crossover. You can buy cheap ADS crossovers on ebay... they are excellent quality... unless partsexpress has something decent and cheaper.

[Dr. evil]

i have been runing with rockford fosgate for some time now and they have been great. still they are alot more expensive but they put out more the what they say they do and the quality in the best around.
If you really what good amp anouther thing to look for is a CEA certification. in the land of "doof bangers" that pretty important.


If it's too loud your too old

[genphreak]

Ok here's another question i just came up with...how do I get the wire running from my headunit line output alllll the way back to my amp? Anyone that had done this do you have any suggestions about where to run the wire? Pictures maybe?Yellow, Blue and brown+trace wires behind your head unit (currently connected to the speaker outs on the head unit) go to the amp as a twisted pair in the car's loom. Disconnect all the input wires to the stock amp.

Grab a 2xRCA-2xRCA lead and cut one set of RCAs cut off one end. Now solder this lead to a pair of the front or rear input wires you cut off the amp. (amp is now not getting any signal). Instead it runs to your new amp.

No runing wires through the cabin necessary. If you want to run separate wires for the Front and Rear (ie your head unit has 2 pairs of line-level (ie RCA connectors) outputs, you could try connecting all 4 as described below. Dash fader will not work properly anymore and if so could be taken out (I doubt its worth it). I have tested that this works on my amps, but not with all 4 or to check the fader function :(

Would love to know about this, care to give it a shot?

PS. Usual disclaimers apply. Be careful... know your wiring skills. After wiring like this, and before plugging RCAs into your amp or radio, make sure that none of your wires are grounding to the car chassis and that both + and - signal wires are also isolated. Connecting shorted leads is a great way to wreck your stereo or amp...