OT Getting in the mood to celebrate

[Gayle]

For our friends outside of the US, tomorrow is a holiday for us Americans. It is the 4th of July, aka Independence Day. It marks the beginning of the family feud with our English speaking cousins across the sea, when we committed to paper "you are not the boss of me" by signing the Declaration of Independence IN 1776.

No one has to work tomorrow. We have picnics, fireworks, drink beer, and paper everything in sight with red, white, and blue stars and stripes. But the best thing about 4th of July celebrations is the 1812 Overture.

The 1812 Overture has nothing to do with American history. It was written by Tchaikovsky to celebrate Napoleons retreat from Moscow in the Napoleonic wars after Napoleon realized he had nothing to feed his troops and it was snowing in Moscow-duh. And yes, we had a war of 1812 when our English cousins came over and burned Washington DC to the ground, but the War of 1812 and the 1812 Overture are totally unrelated.

So why do we play the 1812 overture on July 4th if it has nothing to do with American history? The answer is that WE LOVE THE CANNONS.

Beer cannons (http://www.devilducky.com/media/46502/)





.

[ILoveMPower]

That... was amazing.

I was speechless for the last 5 minutes.

[nuclearfusion]

Wow... that was a spectacle for the ages.

Enjoy!

Fusion

[HDhandyman]

:)That made Taylor laugh so hard, I was concerned she might need to be medicated. "Play it again Dad, play it again!":)

[TheEndIsNear]

Best video I'v seen in years...

[SchnellE34]

No one has to work tomorrow.

I have to work tomorrow. 9 a.m. to 8 p.m. It sucks but the holiday pay aint that bad. Plus um goin to a house party afterwards (the best drinking environment)

[Ross]

Only in America. Okay maybe Oz. I love this country.

[Derek A.]

There is not a lot of bandwidth here but enjoy ! Crank em up loud !

www.atkin.homeip.net/USA

Happy Birthday to the United States of America !

[angrypancake]

I have work tomorrow. At a huge pool, it's always insanity. Drunk people everywhere. It's crazy fun though, we (the guards) split into teams, and whichever team has the fewest amount of saves has to buy the beer for the night. Last year came down to the last "sit" where there were two clutch saves in the last sit ftw, 31 to 29. (and yes, they're all people legitimately drowning). Then comes the Roman Candles out the sunroof on the caravan home, tons of fireworks, and general mayhem, however we all take time to remember what the day means to all.

Oh and you cant forget the amazing bbq food!

[Gayle]

I have work tomorrow. At a huge pool, it's always insanity. 31 to 29. (and yes, they're all people legitimately drowning).



Are you saying that 60 people almost drown in this pool in one day?!?!!

[angrypancake]

yes. the pool holds at capacity around 2000 people. goes from 2" to 11ft. two diving boards, which are where most of the sinkers go down. its usually kids, and here's a typical quote:
"yo, i cant swim, you gonna save me?"
(me: ) "uh no, I'm a rookie and don't know how to swim."
"haha stop playin yo."
then they jump in and drown. most of the time it will be a group of people, all going off the boards, if there's 10, 8 can swim and the other two feel left out and they go off anyways cause they know the lifeguards will save them. their friends laugh, and they don't realize how serious it is.

[The Bigfella]

Happy Birthday America

[angrypancake]

^ wow, amazing looking ///M. more pictures or ban! what kinda wheels are those

[Blitzkrieg Bob]

watch the pool.

Out here, it's the beach and surf....not so forgiving, you can go under and get held down by the surf.

If Lifeguards miss you..you are fish food.

So those who can't swim , build sandcastles and fish.

[HDhandyman]

It's time to let Darwin watch the pool.
LMFAO!!

[Gayle]

Bump Boom Boom

Beer cannons (http://www.devilducky.com/media/46502/)

[Paul in NZ]

i saw a young kid step into a deep pool was trying to reach her mother,she sank like a stone,I grabbed her out

[genphreak]

i saw a young kid step into a deep pool was trying to reach her mother,she sank like a stone,I grabbed her outGood on ya!!

No sharks to get her first? Maybe they were waiting for the kid and you scared 'em off Paul. :) Nick

[genphreak]

Awesome link Gayle, what a laugh. Well Happy Independence Day USA!

Fan-frikkin tastic Cannons!

It's a bit of a waste to use light beer though, seems kinda ninny to not be using full-strength for such a powerful 'production'.

So tell us, is it still a great feeling to be free of the Poms after all this time?

A lot of us here in Aus would like it that way, including me (ex-Pom)- but many (not a majority now) have reservations.

On this day I stop to wonder what an American perspective is;

ie
How does it feel to be completely in charge of your own futures?
Not to have to be cow-towing to a King or Queen
Not to have to worry about being beholden to another country's political process
To be free (as any country can be) to do what you like in the worldI don't agree with any monorchists' argument in Oz, but I have a few concerns of my own over a republican future...

ie
Is a President and a constitution appropriate insurance against politicians taking changing the rules over time to feather their own nests (and those of their mates), until the point (as we are at now (and some would say the US is there too), where the pollies openly wraught the political process as if it and the votes people cast were of no value. I guess this tends to come with (on their part) greatly limited responsibilities, accountabilities and artificial limits on discussion, free speech, freedom, 'a fair go' for everyone and so on...

Here in Oz there is no constitution, our Head of State is the Governor General (chosen by the government) and the Queen really has no part now. It's all up to our pollies to get it right every day and noone apart from the ruling party can scare them unless they act really, really stupidly, which many of them do (a la the Aust Wheat Board enquiry recently).

Our Government used to be overseen by a Senate, but that has been effectively bound and gagged recently (the Wheat Board enquiry would never happen now).

As it was the Government all blamed the company (AWB), the company blamed the Government and the decision has again been delayed until later when it is of less consequence. No-one of consequence really got into trouble for saying very little to the enquiry, though the media were hard on the story. The pollies knew they could drag it out and eventually the public would all switch off. Meanwhile those bastards and their mates took money for supplying Aussie wheat to starving Iraqis and actively scraped secret commissions off the top to give back to Saddam and his cronies so he could eat caviar and his bandits could shoot the sons of our farmers (who incidentally grew the wheat in the first place).

That political fact, and the ramifications of it 'state-side where it has the same potential sting, is the only thing that could make our Government run such an enquiry now. Now, an enquiry can only be called only as an action of choice. It can be a last resort move, after all possible political spin, outright lies, fleeing scapegoats and even utter walls of silence from government ministers.

What is it that stops them making changes in the US that infringes on fair elections, civil rights and freedom of speech? Obviously the consititution is not that effective (as is evidenced by the passing of the Patriot Act recently).

Do you as a people feel that your future is a good one in America?
Do you feel that things are being done efficiently and at an appropriate pace?
Do you feel your process of government will allow you to keep politician 'on the rails' in generations to come and July 4 will remain a celebrated day of reckoning for a people that are as prosperous as any and able to determine their futures, political process and the ability of the community to support generally wholesome, good values?What can we Aussies learn from the Alerican experience?

Apart from coining a damn-hot piece like the 1812, that is...

[joshua43214]

Genphreak,

The answer to you last questions is simple, I will leave it to others to judge how well it works in practice, but the theory is sound.

We have a 3 part government, Judicial, legislative, and executive. Each part has a certian limited power over the other so, they act as a set of checks against each other. The legislative branch enacts laws either through popular vote(done localy) of through representives (done localy and federaly). The executice branch(the president is the boss of this) then is charged with enacting and enforcing the law. The judicial branch then can judge both whether someone is in violation and whether the law itself it legal accordinng to the constition. The executive branch has some limited powers to enact laws or make government action, of which all must be reviewed by the legislative or judicial branch after a certain time depending on the action.

this allows the executive branch to do something like call in the national gaurd in a time of emergency without having to consult the the legislative body ahead of time.

A good example of how the system works well is this. A town passes a law by popular vote that requires blacks to leave the city limits before sundown. The local sherif then arrests the first black he sees at night time and tosses him in jail. The court then decides the law itself is a violation of constitutional rights and the law is then defunct. This is what is commonly called "legislating from the bench" and is a current hot topic in America. But in actuality it is just another check in the system.

So there you have it, am oversimplified explanation of why the US does not devolve into tyranny, or atleast why its not supposed to. The basic idea is that each branch has specific powers that can be monitored and checked by the other branches so that no branch gets all the power. Most of the people involved are elected and so can be replaced, but a few are appointed, generaly by the executive and then approved by the legislative branch.

What can an Aussie learn from an American? Never let your government take away your ability to replace it with another government.

[shuriken]

Like the beer canon link. PMSL.
Glad to see Light Beer was used as a terrible waste of strong/ normal beer.


To genphreak on American law and independence etc, stick with what you have, based on British law. Best and most copied in the world. Just don't go down the "human rights" for all, way. UK sucks at the moment because of it and it's gonna change soon. As for the king/queen route? Well I'm a monarchist, but I see your point. just goes back to the point that our best judges put you all there in the first place! Truefully though, I see no reason for you not to go solo, nothing would change much, for either country.

[Gayle]

Nick

Joshua gave you a good reply. I have no desire to add to his technical explanation. I would add a subjective element.

I have discussed the last two posts with my husband who reads the political websites avidly. I asked his opinion. His comments are "the first thing you learn to say as an American is 'I know my rights'. It is not that our government is free--we are free."

We have many groups with differing and competing interests. We rely on the debates/arguments to keep us on a good course. It is a less formal way of thinking about the checks and balances. The major political parties are very close in strength. Elections are won 51%-49%. That sort of assures that the important agendas of each party get taken care of. It meets the definition of a good compromise--everyone gets some progress on their most important concern and no one gets everything they want.

I sort of think of our experience as being similar to a sack race where we bind ourselves together at the leg and we all get to the finish line--not as fast but we get there together and we win together. It is also like a big noisy family debate around the dinner table. We love the arguing and the process of trying to get the best of each other.

Is our government efficient? Absolutely not. Do we think we are on the right course? It is almost un American to answer that question yes.

Is it good to be an American? We know we have our faults. We know a lot of the rest of the world hates us. But there are very few of us who would pick a different county.

[HDhandyman]

We know a lot of the rest of the world hates us. But there are very few of us who would pick a different county.

Agreed, though I'd move to Italy in a heaertbeat if I could afford it, and that's a real shitty government.

I guess the only thing I'd add is that I think our system of checks and balances has given us a false sence of security. We left our government alone for a long time, and now it has grown into an immense independent power, in and of itself. So much so, that many of us are afraid to stand up to our government, now. We're not like the french (though in many ways, we'd like to be), opposing Big Brother seems like an insurmountable task.

What's nice about the 4th of July is that politicians can do what they want with this day, but it has always, and hopefully always will be, a day when the common man can reflect upon the founding principles of our country and feel good about them. :)

[califblue]

Gayle & eveyone else HAPPY 4th,

I just laid down one of my Motorcycles yesterday @ 70 MPH & walked away with minimal damage to both my body and the Motorcycle:D ... ( gotta love full protection)

Just got back from Surfing( gotta love So.Calif) found me a beach bunny to help me put on Sun tan lotion;)

[califblue]

To quote a very Wise Woman who you all know..."Is it good to be an American? We know we have our faults. We know a lot of the rest of the world hates us. But there are very few of us who would pick a different county."


we might not be the best be we sure BEAT the heck Out of what ever is in Second Place:

GOD BLESS AMERICA & the RED WHITE & BLUE RULES:) AND I STILL GET GOOSE BUMPS AND MY HEART FILLS WITH PRIDE EVERYTIME I HEAR MY NATIONAL ANTHEM...CAN YOU SAY THE SAME?



http://www.labusas.org/photopost/data/500/41flag-o.jpg

P.S. My country has most likely saved your country more than once...trust me on this one

[guinness]

califblue, your P.S. is probably the truest statment ever made. Happy 4th everybody.

[Zeuk in Oz]

On this day I stop to wonder what an American perspective is;

ie
How does it feel to be completely in charge of your own futures?
Not to have to be cow-towing to a King or Queen
Not to have to worry about being beholden to another country's political process
To be free (as any country can be) to do what you like in the worldI don't agree with any monorchists' argument in Oz, but I have a few concerns of my own over a republican future...

ie
Is a President and a constitution appropriate insurance against politicians taking changing the rules over time to feather their own nests (and those of their mates), until the point (as we are at now (and some would say the US is there too), where the pollies openly wraught the political process as if it and the votes people cast were of no value. I guess this tends to come with (on their part) greatly limited responsibilities, accountabilities and artificial limits on discussion, free speech, freedom, 'a fair go' for everyone and so on...

Here in Oz there is no constitution, our Head of State is the Governor General (chosen by the government) and the Queen really has no part now. It's all up to our pollies to get it right every day and noone apart from the ruling party can scare them unless they act really, really stupidly, which many of them do (a la the Aust Wheat Board enquiry recently).

Our Government used to be overseen by a Senate, but that has been effectively bound and gagged recently (the Wheat Board enquiry would never happen now).

As it was the Government all blamed the company (AWB), the company blamed the Government and the decision has again been delayed until later when it is of less consequence. No-one of consequence really got into trouble for saying very little to the enquiry, though the media were hard on the story. The pollies knew they could drag it out and eventually the public would all switch off. Meanwhile those bastards and their mates took money for supplying Aussie wheat to starving Iraqis and actively scraped secret commissions off the top to give back to Saddam and his cronies so he could eat caviar and his bandits could shoot the sons of our farmers (who incidentally grew the wheat in the first place).

That political fact, and the ramifications of it 'state-side where it has the same potential sting, is the only thing that could make our Government run such an enquiry now. Now, an enquiry can only be called only as an action of choice. It can be a last resort move, after all possible political spin, outright lies, fleeing scapegoats and even utter walls of silence from government ministers.

What is it that stops them making changes in the US that infringes on fair elections, civil rights and freedom of speech? Obviously the consititution is not that effective (as is evidenced by the passing of the Patriot Act recently).

Do you as a people feel that your future is a good one in America?
Do you feel that things are being done efficiently and at an appropriate pace?
Do you feel your process of government will allow you to keep politician 'on the rails' in generations to come and July 4 will remain a celebrated day of reckoning for a people that are as prosperous as any and able to determine their futures, political process and the ability of the community to support generally wholesome, good values?What can we Aussies learn from the Alerican experience?

Apart from coining a damn-hot piece like the 1812, that is...

Nick, Nick, Nick. And from someone so young !

Don't make the mistake many others do and think the US is a democracy just because it tells the world it is a democracy.

Knobled decisions at the stacked local branch of either major political party near you are more democratic than the American political process.

How can any national government that brings as draconian a piece of legislation as the ironically named "patriot act" into being cannot be a democracy - ie it cannot give a stuff about the people.

Our problem here in Oz is that our Prime Minister seems to think the sun shines out of George W's ar$e. How democratic is that ?

I like our system for a number of reasons :

Attendance at the voting booth is compulsory - this reduces need to bribe the great unwashed to vote !
The Senate (our upper house federally) is often controlled by the opposition or independents.
The parties vote for leaders, not the voting public.
It is much more difficult to rig as there is much less money involved.
We have a much more representative system with each seat counting, not just majority of state votes.

I dislike our system because it is still manual and electoral fraud is commonplace but probably not really not decisive.
It is a 2 party preferred system which precludes other parties, except as independents.
It is starting to follow the US evangelistic theme.

My answer :

200 housewives who routinely manage a family budget of less than 100k.

They would have the place running like a top in 6 months and all the beurocrats would be looking for new jobs. :D

Edit : re-read my post and realise it comes across as America bashing. Not my intention. I am just a true cynic who trusts no form of government in any country and I was just making a few comparisons.

I admire the US sense of nationalism but at the same time fear the isolationist mentality of many in the US which leads to ignorance of anything outside its borders. Unavoidable perhaps, but not desireable. This forum obviously works to increase all our international awareness.

I also admire what US once stood for but wonder if the same can be said of the America of today. I presume that after so many kicks in the teeth, that is also to be expected.

Anyway, apologies if anything I said upset you - that was not was intended. Enjoy your holiday as only Americans can !

[rob101]

nick can't you just let them drink beer on the 4th of july
after all BMA is in the USA
i think that is worth something lol

[632 Regal]

I bought a monkey!

http://web.syr.edu/~cjbryzgo/monkey%20smile.jpg

[Gayle]

We left our government alone for a long time, and now it has grown into an immense independent power, in and of itself. So much so, that many of us are afraid to stand up to our government, now. opposing Big Brother seems like an insurmountable task.



These pictures were taken in Pittsburgh. People are obviously afraid to stand up to the government there.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/3fueleffeciency.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/2arabsguard.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/5leavebombs.jpg

[Gayle]

Very afraid to express their opinion about government programs. Or speak badly about the government.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/4english.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/7robbery.jpg


http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/9bundergod.jpg

[Gayle]

The fear of government extends to all levels--national, state, local.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/9asocialsecurity.jpg




http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/8choc.jpg


http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/6seatbelts.jpg

[Gayle]

We may have freedom of speech, but people are obviously afraid to use it.



http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/14thofjuly.jpg


http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/9capprovemessage.jpg


http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/9.jpg





opposing Big Brother seems like an insurmountable task.



Really???

[Bill R.]

their freedom of speech, except for some white supremist pricks like this,
http://www.post-gazette.com/images4/20060702ppcontroversialsign_450.jpg

It must really upset him that they don't have a local John Birch or KKK chapter.






We may have freedom of speech, but people are obviously afraid to use it.



http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/14thofjuly.jpg


http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/9capprovemessage.jpg


http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/9.jpg





Really???

[Gayle]

Yes, really. Most people are afraid to use their freedom of speech, except for some white supremist pricks like this.




Bill--Your post makes my original point--the thing that is great about this country is that everyone can express their opinion. I maintain my original position that it is like one be noisy family discussion around the dinner table, even if we vehemently disagree.

[And I assume you know that I don't endose those opinions on those signs--but I endose his right to say his opinion publicly. I am a big advocate of free speech and challenging thought].

And white supremists pricks aren't the only ones who exercise their freedom of speech.

"It seemed like a good idea to burn some flags just because we can" (http://www.santacruzsentinel.com/archive/2006/July/04/local/stories/06local.htm)

[trumpetr]

Only in america, where Illegal immigrants buy illegal fireworks from Native American tribes, and shoot them off celebrating white peoples independance.
God Bless America.

[Ross]

This looks like the perfect place to marry my sister.

[guinness]

their freedom of speech, except for some white supremist pricks like this,
http://www.post-gazette.com/images4/20060702ppcontroversialsign_450.jpg

It must really upset him that they don't have a local John Birch or KKK chapter.
Bill R, what part of his message is about being a white supremist? all I see is a guy who is mad at his government and using his sign to send out his opinion.
Jim

[Bill R.]

see 3 pages of his signs. Then tell me that you don't notice a little bit of bias there?
(http://www.casadice.com/signs/index.htm)
And if you search further on the internet you can find numerous articles about him and how some of the townspeople react to some of his statements.




Bill R, what part of his message is about being a white supremist? all I see is a guy who is mad at his government and using his sign to send out his opinion.
Jim

[HDhandyman]

OMG, can't believe this conversation went this way.

can't believe Gayle took the time to post all those pictures of that racist bastard.

[guinness]

see 3 pages of his signs. Then tell me that you don't notice a little bit of bias there?
(http://www.casadice.com/signs/index.htm)
And if you search further on the internet you can find numerous articles about him and how some of the townspeople react to some of his statements.
Bill R, You got me on the signs.some of them are very bad. That being said some of them are on the money. I am a naturalized American citizen and it really pisses me off watching all the illegals coming over the border when others wait for years to come to the U.S. the right way. I guess that's what I focused on when I looked at the pics.
Jim

[Gayle]

It is the fact that even the most fringe people in our society can burn flags or post billboards that wig people out on a daily basis that makes the point that people are not afraid to oppose the government or express their opinion, no matter how sick and twisted their opinions are. And the fact that people the town that guy lives in are outraged but he can still do it proves the point.

Yeah, posting his pictures was extreme. But you gotta see what we can do in this country to believe it. I don't think the point would have been made by saying "oh people aren't really afraid to oppose the government". Or would the wide boundaries of our freedom of speech been made been illustrated by posting feel good patriotic pictures like this set of banners that fly in my hood year round illustrating the song "God Bless America".

Show me another country where the rights of all are as protected as this one. It's not perfect and not everyone is treated as well as they should be, but like califblue said--we sure BEAT the heck Out of what ever is in Second Place.

And it is not the government that scares me. The government is like an overweight elephant. It might step on you out of clumsiness and stupidity, but retaliate against the opposition--I just don't think so. That is my opinion and I am sticking to it.

And it is not that I am fearless. What scares the bejesus out of me is the thought police among us. And one of the reasons I love this board so much is it is a respite for the growing scourge of political correctness sweeping this country.

Do these pics from my hood make my point? Maybe not the one about it is safe to oppose the government, but they do show what a great country this is in that our individuality and creativity flourish in a variety of ways.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/1bless.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/2guide.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/3mountains.jpg
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c21/e34Gayle/4prairie.jpg

[Blitzkrieg Bob]

to something like this...

We all won't say it, but I know some of us still think it.

[HDhandyman]

I guess we'll have to just have to agree to disagree. Maybe it's an age thing, maybe it's a California thing. Either way, there are no hard feelings on this end, and it's all in good sport.

I just don't feel like we have the European mentality about our government. Maybe it's just because European countries are relatively small in comparison to ours, and we just can't get enough of our people together on issues. Or maybe it's just that we don't have a history of revolt against the Gov. Perhaps it's because we aren't a 2000 year old country that has learned how to maintain the status quo and won't put up with shitty new trends.

You can point to one white supremist or another, and go "free speech here, free speech there, 60s this, & 2nd place that" and we are a great country .

But you wanna give everyone in France mandatory drug tests for employment...."STRIKE" (country wide)

You wanna raise the age of retirement in Italy...."STRIKE" (country wide)

Wanna make it easier for young people in France to be fired...."STRIKE" (country wide)

How about Socialized Medicine? Oh no, Bristol Meyers Squib and Flaxo won't ever let that happen. And neither will the politicians that they own (most of them).

I just think we need to put a little more spirit behind it!:)

[Airborne001]

I like the thing about pressing 1 for english. Anyone want to take a guess what would happen to me if I moved to Mexico and demanded that they give me a ballot in English? ..................adios senor.