New on here - tranny swap Q

[fassgti]

OK edited my post:

i just bought a 1987 auto tranny, and would like to know how interchangeable it is with my 89 535i tranny. i have the sport and manual modes on my 89 tranny, and don't know if the 87 is capable. they look the same, so i am thinking that they work the same. also where can i look for the tranny code?

[gale]

Not too hard, really not much more work than doing a clutch R&R. The biggest pain is swapping the pedal cluster. You can do the pedal cluster swap in advance while lining up the rest of the parts and still be able to drive it with the automatic & let the clutch pedal rest on the floor in the interim.

You might get by without having to swap diff's since yours should have a 3.91, but that's pretty extreme. A 3.64 or 3.73 would be better. You'll need to get a new driveshaft since the manual trans is about 6" shorter than the automatic & has a different front yoke. Everything is just about pure nuts & bolts without any butchering or customizing & you'll find the bolt holes & openings for the clutch hydraulics and shifter will already be in place in your chassis.

You can source most of the parts from a salvage yard such as www.eurodepot.com but DON'T use a dual-mass flywheel, a conventional e28 (or e12 or e9) flywheel is lighter & much cheaper.

Here's a summary I did a few years ago:

http://www.nmia.com/~dgnrg/page_41.htm

use www.realoem.com for part numbers & diagrams.

[fassgti]

Not too hard, really not much more work than doing a clutch R&R. The biggest pain is swapping the pedal cluster. You can do the pedal cluster swap in advance while lining up the rest of the parts and still be able to drive it with the automatic & let the clutch pedal rest on the floor in the interim.

You might get by without having to swap diff's since yours should have a 3.91, but that's pretty extreme. A 3.64 or 3.73 would be better. You'll need to get a new driveshaft since the manual trans is about 6" shorter than the automatic & has a different front yoke. Everything is just about pure nuts & bolts without any butchering or customizing & you'll find the bolt holes & openings for the clutch hydraulics and shifter will already be in place in your chassis.

You can source most of the parts from a salvage yard such as www.eurodepot.com but DON'T use a dual-mass flywheel, a conventional e28 (or e12 or e9) flywheel is lighter & much cheaper.

Here's a summary I did a few years ago:

http://www.nmia.com/~dgnrg/page_41.htm

use www.realoem.com for part numbers & diagrams.

sorry i forgot to mention, mines an automatic trans also. i have the sport and manual mode switch, and i just wanted to replace it with a transmission that doesn't have that.

[gale]

Oops, my bad. You mean you want to use an older e23 or e28 non-electronic 4hp22? Don't know the specifics such as maybe having to swap output flanges, but it should work ok. Might have to jumper the TCU or CCM pin to ground to get rid of the trans program error message that will display when the 4hp22eh cable is unplugged.

[fassgti]

well i was in L.A. the other week, and i saw an '89 525i being parted and as i have mine in the shop because of the transmission problem, (only gets reverse, no forward gears) i asked about the transmission and he said i could have it and other parts i inquired about for 300, which to me isn't a bad price, i asked if it had sport shift and he said no. is he wrong do all auto e34's have sport shift?

[gale]

well i was in L.A. the other week, and i saw an '89 525i being parted and as i have mine in the shop because of the transmission problem, (only gets reverse, no forward gears) i asked about the transmission and he said i could have it and other parts i inquired about for 300, which to me isn't a bad price, i asked if it had sport shift and he said no. is he wrong do all auto e34's have sport shift?

??? That's not gonna work. The 525i has the GM trans & won't mate to your m30 engine block. You might be better off sourcing a good used 4hp22 from Autobahn in San Diego, or other salvage outfit closer to LA. No forward gears could be simply the valve body but more likely there are other problems as well & could get expensive it you let a shop open it up. You could search the archives here or on Roadfly's e34 or e32 forum for a link to Kirt Koehler's phone number. He can steer you in the right direction up to and including a total rebuild and is quite reasonable cost-wise.

To answer your sport mode question, yes, I believe all e34 automatics whether it be a 525i, 535i, 530i, or 540i automatics all have the electro-hydraulic shift and have sport mode. Maybe someone else will weigh in if I'm wrong.

[ryan roopnarine]

m20 engined 525i's with the zf transmission, iirc, can come without the "sport shift". no m20 equipped car came with a gm transmission. i want to say that both the m20 and m30 cars had 4hp22, but that they differed in some way (such as one being 4hp22 and the other being 4hp22eh).

[fassgti]

gale:
About the whole L.A. thing, i live in texas and wouldn't be able to take my car over there to get it fixed, unless i towed it. I fly to L.A. every other week for work, and was thinking that if i could swap from a sport to a reg tranny i would buy it and have myself a good ole fashioned road trip via u-haul.
ryan_roopnarine:
how can i find out, or have the guy find out which transmission is in it? any specific 4hp22/eh characteristics?
would the non sport shift 4hp work on my car? or am i better off just getting a JY transmission, or a rebuild?

[gale]

In that case, if you're anywhere close to Austin, check with Rhett at:

http://www.terrysaytherauto.com/loose.parts.htm

They're a good salvage outfit & could probably install another trans for a reasonable price.

[ryan roopnarine]

ryan_roopnarine:
how can i find out, or have the guy find out which transmission is in it? any specific 4hp22/eh characteristics?
would the non sport shift 4hp work on my car? or am i better off just getting a JY transmission, or a rebuild?

i'm not sure how to determine that, as i don't own a m20 or m30 car, and might lead you in the wrong direction.

[fassgti]

edited my first post.

[fassgti]

anyone?

[Kalevera]

It won't work unless the auto trans was sourced from an E32/E34 (euro E34, that is, as they didn't import any '87s) AND your car was built before 12/88.

Two different versions of AEGS, and the parts are not interchangeable. You could try swapping valve bodies, don't know.

[fassgti]

ok here's the part #s off of the tranny i just bought:

0668483 Getriebe
1043010517 Stucklisten
4hp22

is this tranny compatible with a 1989 535i

[fassgti]

ok here's the part #s off of the tranny i just bought:

0668483 Getriebe
1043010517 Stucklisten
4hp22

is this tranny compatible with a 1989 535i

what are the numbers off of an 89 535i?

[fassgti]

anyone, please?

[Kalevera]

what are the numbers off of an 89 535i?
Don't you have one in your car?

The numbers will be meaningless to anyone except a ZF insider.

Best bet is to find a car in the same production range and use its transmission. If your car was built after 12/88, then find one of those.

[fassgti]

Oh, yes i should, but i don't have the car with me, it's in another city. I guess since i have the sport tranny in the car it should be a 4hp22eh and not a 4hp22

[Kalevera]

There are three different versions of the 4hp-22EH. And, again, they're not interchangeable unless you want to swap valve bodies, and if that is even possible (I don't know the specific differences, but I know there are fewer solenoids in the later versions versus earlier).

The first EH version first showed up in 1983 on all 745i Turbos and was used in various forms on pretty much every 5, 6 and 7 series car through the 1992 7 and 1993 5 model years. Before that, the regular, non electrically controlled version was around for a few years, and it was used on every 3 series car I can think of, and M20 based (and early M30 based) 5 series, both E28 and E34, through 1990.

Again, if the car was produced 12/88 or later, you need a late version from any >11/88 535 or any E32 735i/iL from the same dates.

Also, the quick way to check compatibility is to count the number of pins at the transmission harness connector. Late units have 7 pins, earlier have 8. Those numbers might be 8 late/9 early, it's not clear in my mind at the moment, but there's a one pin difference.

[fassgti]

the replacement transmission i have does not have the TCU plug, so i don't know if it will work, like i said before i don't care if i get a tranny code. but can i swap a regular hydrauilic transmission into my car if it came with the electronic/hydraulic transmission?

[Kalevera]

Ah, sorry, I missed that info. Sure, it will work if you can figure out how to hook up the kickdown cable

[fassgti]

ok, how does that work? is this whats also reffered to as the passing gear cable?

[632 Regal]

yes, you should be able to figure all these numbers and such from the www.realoem.com site.
is this whats also reffered to as the passing gear cable?

[fassgti]

on a hydraulic 4hp22 where does the cable go? and on a 4hp22/eh?
i was noticing on some pictures the selector lever for the gears on eh's is pointed down, and on the 4hp22 i have its up

[632 Regal]

I dont forsee a smooth transition for you.
on a hydraulic 4hp22 where does the cable go? and on a 4hp22/eh?
i was noticing on some pictures the selector lever for the gears on eh's is pointed down, and on the 4hp22 i have its up

[fassgti]

i should just redo the "a" clutch pack and get my money back for the one i purchased then? where can i get the parts for just the "a" clutch job?

[Kalevera]

If that's what's wrong with the transmission, then return the replacement transmission and fix the existing one. Winfred has a writeup on doing the job, and there's also a good factory writeup in TIS, if you can get access to that. The master rebuild kit for the trans was ~ $200 the last time I looked up the price, that includes all soft parts and seals, so if it just blew the A clutches and you can find a place that will sell you those parts, I think it's the best move.

[fassgti]

well, since i don't know what TIS is, then i probably don't have access to it... :P
where did you find the overhaul parts for the tranny??

[RallyD]

try dropping the selector lever into 1. then you can shift threough 2+3 but not D.
if the car will move now, the problem is in the sprag clutch, otherwise clutch pack A could be the culprit.

Jaggi is in Texas and can get you parts 1-800-874-7753
have the last three numbers off of your transmission before you call because they identify which 4hp22 you have.

i really hate automatics

oh and if you cant figure this out, get rid of your car and get a honda. if you decide to keep tour 535, fix the stupid wiper rig job (not an E class) and peel that lousy 1/2 chrome tint off.

[fassgti]

try dropping the selector lever into 1. then you can shift threough 2+3 but not D.
if the car will move now, the problem is in the sprag clutch, otherwise clutch pack A could be the culprit.

Jaggi is in Texas and can get you parts 1-800-874-7753
have the last three numbers off of your transmission before you call because they identify which 4hp22 you have.

i really hate automatics

oh and if you cant figure this out, get rid of your car and get a honda. if you decide to keep tour 535, fix the stupid wiper rig job (not an E class) and peel that lousy 1/2 chrome tint off.

I already tried the 1 to 2 to 3 gear change, and it won't move. Thanks for the Jaggi number.
No thanks on the Honda, I'm a European car owner and don't want any japanese cars. I am mainly a VW owner as i also have 7 vw's but my wife loves her beemer, and i want to fix it for her, i don't mind paying but i want to learn for myself. Oh and the pic in my sig is of the day we bought it and took it home.
Now it sports shadowline, two wipers(:P), a respray, BBS RS wheels(16X10rear 16X8front)2" drop, and 20% tint all around. I know a lil on the german look(from my vw's) so I incorporated it to my BMW. This is her car and not mine so thats all she let me do. Looking for a late nineties 7 series for myself tho.

[RallyD]

oh thank goodness. i was worried for ya. lets see an updated pic, i'm thinking about shadowline, but not 100% sure. Euros are great, but usually need more attention, and special tools (aaargh)

but yeah i've had a bunch of vw's, rabbits, a mk2 gti, vanagon camper and my current cabbie. I really like the bmw though, built so much better than vw.
I'm looking around now for a second e34, 5 speed 525 m50.

Definitely get the bentley book for the e34, i made a post in the classifieds on the best price i could find. it is available free in pdf form online (great to print disposable copies), but there is just something about a hard copy that i like.

[fassgti]

yeah my bently is on it's way, i know all about the bently(i do have vw's :P )
no updated shots of the e34 as of yet, when the transmission went, i took off the bbs' and went back to stockers.
As for the shadowline, if you want to know what your looks like with it, do what i did. i put black electrical tape over the chrome moldings and looked at it. i definately liked it a whole lot more with the shadowline.