Who's interested in a MAF conversion ?

[MarkD]

I've been working on a MAF conversion and have a prototype which should be in production in June. I have it running on a 3.2l Metric mechanic M20 and will adapt it to the M30 also.

Each version will come with a custom EAT chip for the specific motor.

Here are a few pictures:
http://rides.webshots.com/album/558726438RfkIha

The M20 now has much improved throttle response and driveability. You can actually accellerate from 1200 rpm in 3rd or 4th gear.

MarkD

[winfred]

i would be but i am a week or two away from megasquirt, i am planning on trying the dual map/maf setup but ill be using one outta the yard off a late bimmer. i will be spreading the word that you have one coming out

[clevertd]

I'm sure there's a sizeable market for this... just look at the response Miller got on bf.c

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=708521

[wjbell]

Wow, I'd be interested, depending on the price of course. I've been thinking of an EAT chip for a while and a MAF would be nice too.

Will the MAF bolt right in to where the AFM is on the M30, using the stock boots and airbox? Will there be any manual adjusting for the MAF or is it "Plug and Play"? (can't remember your response from my older thread)

[MarkD]

Wow, I'd be interested, depending on the price of course. I've been thinking of an EAT chip for a while and a MAF would be nice too.

Will the MAF bolt right in to where the AFM is on the M30, using the stock boots and airbox? Will there be any manual adjusting for the MAF or is it "Plug and Play"? (can't remember your response from my older thread)


I didn't make the M30 system yet, but it will drop in where the current AFM is and connect to the airbox. It required no adjustment, but will come with a new EAT chip tuned for each application. There is no adjustment required.


The price will be around $700 - $750 but I honestly beleive it's worth every penny. If you saw it on the m20b32 you guys would be shocked.

The parts to make this are quite expensive. (especially the MAF) and also, I have to re-tune all the chips for this setup.

I'm using a 3" diameter MAF. Another company that sells MAF conversions does not use such a good MAF.


Mark

[Qube]

It all boils down to price :) Do I get a rebate with an existing EAT chip? Cash and carry if I come by and visit? ;)

[MarkD]

i would be but i am a week or two away from megasquirt, i am planning on trying the dual map/maf setup but ill be using one outta the yard off a late bimmer. i will be spreading the word that you have one coming out

Hi Winfred,

I wish you would have had a chance to try this out. You should drive over to Metric Mechnic and see the car, it's really fast.

Mark

[wjbell]

I didn't make the M30 system yet, but it will drop in where the current AFM is and connect to the airbox. It required no adjustment, but will come with a new EAT chip tuned for each application. There is no adjustment required.


The price will be around $700 - $750 but I honestly beleive it's worth every penny. If you saw it on the m20b32 you guys would be shocked.

The parts to make this are quite expensive. (especially the MAF) and also, I have to re-tune all the chips for this setup.

I'm using a 3" diameter MAF. Another company that sells MAF conversions does not use such a good MAF.


Mark


That may be doable for me... What is the expected HP/torque gains from this system? I've heard a MAF improves throttle response, are the any other benefits?

Two other question I'd have before buying this... I've seen MAF conversions before that have to use a tuning box where you need to tune your own A/F mixture because the M30 is set up for the AFM and has no way to regulate the MAF. (guessing here) So I guess the custom EAT chip works with the new MAF? Is that the way the cars that come with a MAF do it? Just curious..

And the biggie... is this California smog legal? I think I've read that the EAT chip actually tested better for emissions, but what about the modification of the AFM. Could that cause them to fail it?

[clevertd]

Price and gains, as I'm sure you know. If you can prove without a doubt that yours is worth the few extra hundred, people will go for it based on your reputation and willingness to publish results *cough*.

[Blitzkrieg Bob]

will the onboard diagnostics still work with the new chip?

[myles]

I'm interested. Depends on price, install, fuel economy and required fuel octane.

[MarkD]

Price and gains, as I'm sure you know. If you can prove without a doubt that yours is worth the few extra hundred, people will go for it based on your reputation and willingness to publish results *cough*.

Sure I can publish dyno runs, but the increases you will see with a MAF are not easily measured with a dyno. What you really need to measure is the accelleration when you just hit the gas. Throttle response is greatly improved. I'm also seeing better gas mileage on the car here.

Mark

[BFEINZIMER]

I second question previously posted, price, CA smog legal, and compatibility (no little side effects)

also to my own confusion markd, who sells the chips ( i have one) are you also miller performance? lol confusion

[gale]

Plug-n-play, right? No flat spots? No CEL problems? No emissions problems? Definitely interested in the m30 version, keep us posted. I'll keep my existing EAT chip for later this summer when my son convets his e34 to a 5-spd.

[MarkD]

I second question previously posted, price, CA smog legal, and compatibility (no little side effects)

also to my own confusion markd, who sells the chips ( i have one) are you also miller performance? lol confusion


I thought I answered the price question earlier in this thread. Probably $700 to 750 (no more) complete with a tuned chip. Just the MAF parts - MAF, harness , adapter and bracket will cost over $300 for me to buy in quantity. Plus you get the famed EAT chip included.

No I'm not associated with the other company. I though you know that my site is www.dsylva-tech.ca

Honestly, I don't know how they can make their unit and sell it for the price they do. The metal housing they use expensive to make. But they use a cheap Ford MAF with 1989 technology in it. I'm using a pretty pricey MAF with a fast response time.



Mark

[kev535i]

I'd be interested

[BigKriss]

I think usd$700 is quite expensive mark. Martin in Bellevue went with a map setup using split second products. I'm sure it ended up well below that price. I can't find any links at the moment though.

[clevertd]

Sure I can publish dyno runs, but the increases you will see with a MAF are not easily measured with a dyno. What you really need to measure is the accelleration when you just hit the gas. Throttle response is greatly improved. I'm also seeing better gas mileage on the car here.


I know, I've got the Miller MAF conversion on my car. I started a thread w/ the dyno results, pretty sure I posted the dyno graph, if not here, it's definitely at bf.c. I can link, if you like. As you said, throttle response has greatly improved and I really don't need to rev the car that high (but I do anyway:D ).



But they use a cheap Ford MAF with 1989 technology in it.
Mark

The operators of the dyno where I did my run remarked on that, asking where I got it from and saying that it looked exactly what was on a lot of the Mustangs they dyno'd.

[winfred]

the split second kits i've seen are usually damn close to a grand, seen a couple that weren't happy with them too, one guy said he got tired of needing to screw with the knobs every time the weather changed to keep it running good, i think martin used a aftermarket system that was in the $600s, i think the company went **** up though as i was looking for them a while back


I think usd$700 is quite expensive mark. Martin in Bellevue went with a map setup using split second products. I'm sure it ended up well below that price. I can't find any links at the moment though.

[winfred]

that and their proprietary chip was the reasons i wasn't in love with the miller after i saw it the first time



Honestly, I don't know how they can make their unit and sell it for the price they do. The metal housing they use expensive to make. But they use a cheap Ford MAF with 1989 technology in it. I'm using a pretty pricey MAF with a fast response time.



Mark

[BFEINZIMER]

I thought I answered the price question earlier in this thread. Probably $700 to 750 (no more) complete with a tuned chip. Just the MAF parts - MAF, harness , adapter and bracket will cost over $300 for me to buy in quantity. Plus you get the famed EAT chip included.

No I'm not associated with the other company. I though you know that my site is www.dsylva-tech.ca (http://www.dsylva-tech.ca)

Honestly, I don't know how they can make their unit and sell it for the price they do. The metal housing they use expensive to make. But they use a cheap Ford MAF with 1989 technology in it. I'm using a pretty pricey MAF with a fast response time.


Mark


ok lol i re read the thread and have a better understanding now...yea how does the rebate with the old chip work i have an ecu 179 rev 6500

[wjbell]

Well, like I said earlier, I'd buy a setup like this for ~700.

But... thing's I'd like to know before dropping 7 big ones would be:

-what the HP benefit would be
-are there any other benefits to a MAF other than throttle response?

What I _need_ to know is

-will it pass CA smog?
-(like someone else said) will there be any adverse characteristics running this system as compared to stock AFM and chip?

[BFEINZIMER]

exactly what wjbell said lol post spam!!

[MarkD]

that and their proprietary chip was the reasons i wasn't in love with the miller after i saw it the first time


Their system looks very similar to what Autothority sold back about 20 years ago. ;)

[MarkD]

Well, like I said earlier, I'd buy a setup like this for ~700.

But... thing's I'd like to know before dropping 7 big ones would be:

-what the HP benefit would be
-are there any other benefits to a MAF other than throttle response?

What I _need_ to know is

-will it pass CA smog?
-(like someone else said) will there be any adverse characteristics running this system as compared to stock AFM and chip?


I'll try to have some hp gains in the form of dyno charts after I dyno this in Toronto. It won't be for about 6 weeks or so.

Yes I mentioned that there will be slightly better fuel economy and driveability.

It should easily pass the Ontario smog and I think the CA smog is similar.

There is no reason that there would be adverse effects as compared to a stock AFM and chip. If there were, it would be pointless for me to try and sell it.

I think some of you know about Metric Mechanic and the high performance motors they build. The car that I developed this on is an e30 with an m20b32
and if you had a ride in it you would see how it's been transformed. I'll post a link to videos as soon as they are available. Jim Rowe is really hyped up on this conversion after seeing what it did to the test car.

[javoresku]

Will there be a version for my car? 530i I mean.

[clevertd]

Will there be a version for my car? 530i I mean.

You have a MAF from the factory.

[MarkD]

ok lol i re read the thread and have a better understanding now...yea how does the rebate with the old chip work i have an ecu 179 rev 6500

Did I mention a rebate? I've been working hard till after 8:00 pm each day so can't remember. Well I'll probably apply 80% of the original chip price to the new system. The old chip must be returned to get the rebate.

[myles]

You have a MAF from the factory.

No he doesn't, he has the M30 six version of the 530i, not the V8 M60 model.

[Qube]

Did I mention a rebate? I've been working hard till after 8:00 pm each day so can't remember. Well I'll probably apply 80% of the original chip price to the new system. The old chip must be returned to get the rebate.

Excellent. Let us know when ready.

[Jeff N.]

Both Martin and I have run the Pro-M MAF conversion kit. This was the same kit the Bruno adapted for his short lived offering. Pro-M is now out of business so you can no longer get it. This kit is still installed on my car; Martin's unit died and he moved on to a different solution. Pro-M sold kit sold for about $650. The unit on my car is the original Bruno unit which I purchased it from him when he sold his 535. The Pro-m kit is a 'universal' solution where you have a translator box that attempts to mimic the VAF meter signal with some success See the comments below on the temp issue.

Martin's current unit is a MAP based Split Second box - PCT something or other. Unit itself is about $275 or so and the countless hours he's got into tuning it. Works well but unless you plan to start from his maps (btw, he's running 21lb injectors so his map would be off unless you swapped to them) it's far from a plug and play solution.

The tempature problem you mention is real. Fundamentally it's caused by a basic difference in how the Bosch VAF (vane air flow) meter and the MAF system deal with air density changes due to temp. The VAF unit does not inherently adjust for density differences with due to temp. To do this, it has an AIT (air intake temp) sensor which feeds the Motronic system. This drives an offset table which adjusts fuel and (maybe) timing to account for temperture density differences.

The MAF unit of course has a hot wire sensor which does account for changes in temperture. When you add in a AIT sensor - which the motronic expects to see - the offset in the chip is no longer correct for an identical change in the ambient temp. This mismatch is what causes the problems with the MAF conversions and changes in air temps. My Pro-M unit has this issue. With the adjustable box, you can manage it but it's still a headache.

The best MAF solution you could come up with is what both Mark and Miller are proposing. A MAF unit with matched chip, including a solution for the AIT issue mentioned above. I've met with Dan Miller and they claim to address this. I know Mark and I'm sure his unit will absolutely address this. I think both solutions are spot on - the final difference will be in the chip interface to the MAF and the chip performance tuning itself. Mark's large chip portfolio speaks for itself here.

Jeff

[clevertd]

No he doesn't, he has the M30 six version of the 530i, not the V8 M60 model.

Ah, I don't read signatures, and you know how we Americans love the V8.

[bmwrp8]

I'd like to have that mod:D

[genphreak]

To anyone wth an AFM, I heartily reccomend a MAF conversion. They are freakin awesome. My car has never run so good and I have to stop myself overtaking all the time for the fun- driving for economy is so much more sensible. It has such an improved mid and upper power curve I now know why the 535 became so well reputed throughout its life. :) Nick

btw; Great work MarkD, anyone with your chip will be a keen bean...

[Paul in NZ]

will this work with a"dirty M30"?My car was produced for a leaded market so has no oxygen sensor feedback to the ECU

[MarkD]

will this work with a"dirty M30"?My car was produced for a leaded market so has no oxygen sensor feedback to the ECU

I expect it will, but would have to actually test it out. It comes with a new chip so I'd have to develop that.

What DME and software do you have?

Mark

[MarkD]

Both Martin and I have run the Pro-M MAF conversion kit. This was the same kit the Bruno adapted for his short lived offering. Pro-M is now out of business so you can no longer get it. This kit is still installed on my car; Martin's unit died and he moved on to a different solution. Pro-M sold kit sold for about $650. The unit on my car is the original Bruno unit which I purchased it from him when he sold his 535. The Pro-m kit is a 'universal' solution where you have a translator box that attempts to mimic the VAF meter signal with some success See the comments below on the temp issue.

Martin's current unit is a MAP based Split Second box - PCT something or other. Unit itself is about $275 or so and the countless hours he's got into tuning it. Works well but unless you plan to start from his maps (btw, he's running 21lb injectors so his map would be off unless you swapped to them) it's far from a plug and play solution.

The tempature problem you mention is real. Fundamentally it's caused by a basic difference in how the Bosch VAF (vane air flow) meter and the MAF system deal with air density changes due to temp. The VAF unit does not inherently adjust for density differences with due to temp. To do this, it has an AIT (air intake temp) sensor which feeds the Motronic system. This drives an offset table which adjusts fuel and (maybe) timing to account for temperture density differences.

The MAF unit of course has a hot wire sensor which does account for changes in temperture. When you add in a AIT sensor - which the motronic expects to see - the offset in the chip is no longer correct for an identical change in the ambient temp. This mismatch is what causes the problems with the MAF conversions and changes in air temps. My Pro-M unit has this issue. With the adjustable box, you can manage it but it's still a headache.

The best MAF solution you could come up with is what both Mark and Miller are proposing. A MAF unit with matched chip, including a solution for the AIT issue mentioned above. I've met with Dan Miller and they claim to address this. I know Mark and I'm sure his unit will absolutely address this. I think both solutions are spot on - the final difference will be in the chip interface to the MAF and the chip performance tuning itself. Mark's large chip portfolio speaks for itself here.

Jeff

Thanks Jeff. Yes the unit has an IAT sensor. I'll post some more pictures at the original link later today. Here is the link: http://rides.webshots.com/album/558726438RfkIha

Mark

[txp135]

Hi Mark, I sent you email twice and PM you once in the past week. Did you get any of them?

[MarkD]

Hi Mark, I sent you email twice and PM you once in the past week. Did you get any of them?

I saw one yesterday, but I've been really busy here at Metric Mechanic. I'm not at my home. I have two cars to tune in about 10 minutes, with the MAF conversion. I'll try to answer later today after I'm done.

Mark

[Robin-535im]

Count me in as definitely interested, Especially with the chip rebate... I assume you can send out the unit and credit back the 80% upon receipt of chip so I don't need to wait sans auto. A custom chip tuning service would be interesting too, some sort of fixed price for a handful of "re-burns"... Just got my Schrick 284 in the mail yesterday and I'd be interested in tuning a chip to match the cam.

[misfortune]

woot. I'm in. I still haven't chipped my 535i now, and my AFM just went out. Ima try to get it working on the cheap and grab this up later on.

[Anton CH.]

What kind of MAF are you using?

[winfred]

you can try popping the plastic cover off and cleaning the trace with a good non residual solvent, good chance it's just dirty and a cleaning will get you going


woot. I'm in. I still haven't chipped my 535i now, and my AFM just went out. Ima try to get it working on the cheap and grab this up later on.

[Hector]

then you can count me in as well.


I've been working on a MAF conversion and have a prototype which should be in production in June. I have it running on a 3.2l Metric mechanic M20 and will adapt it to the M30 also.

Each version will come with a custom EAT chip for the specific motor.

Here are a few pictures:
http://rides.webshots.com/album/558726438RfkIha

The M20 now has much improved throttle response and driveability. You can actually accellerate from 1200 rpm in 3rd or 4th gear.

MarkD

[rob101]

Mark you guys don't have anything for a Euro 528i do you, I think my AFM is screwed and I might consider going MAF. especially with the sacarcity of non-rooted AFM's around here.

[slvre34]

Absolutely as long as it is CA legal. I have your chip now. It rocks.

[misfortune]

you can try popping the plastic cover off and cleaning the trace with a good non residual solvent, good chance it's just dirty and a cleaning will get you going
Lets assume I'm a huge idiot with some knowledge of electronics, could you be more specific?

[winfred]

pry plastic top off of afm, apply contact cleaner and lint free wiping device to moving parts, glue cover back on, part may resume normal operations


Lets assume I'm a huge idiot with some knowledge of electronics, could you be more specific?

[MarkD]

pry plastic top off of afm, apply contact cleaner and lint free wiping device to moving parts, glue cover back on, part may resume normal operations


And if you still have problems after doing that, try bending the wiper a bit to make the contact move inwards (closer to the shaft) by about 0.5mm, so the wiper contacts the carbon trace on a fresh area, instead of the track it has probably worn out.

[MarkD]

Mark you guys don't have anything for a Euro 528i do you, I think my AFM is screwed and I might consider going MAF. especially with the sacarcity of non-rooted AFM's around here.


Not yet. I'd have to find a car here to develop the system. What DME does that have?
It's not likely that I would develop that until all the more common units are in production, and only if I was sure I could get at least 10 sales. Their is a great deal of work to develop each chip.

Mark

[MarkD]

What kind of MAF are you using?

A hot film sensor. If I told you more, I'd have to run you over! :D

[wjbell]

Do you have any estimate on when this will be ready to sell for the M30?

[MarkD]

Do you have any estimate on when this will be ready to sell for the M30?

No. After performing more testing on the M20 version this past week, I see that there is more work involved to get the system to run 100% perfectly. It could be in June, but it may be a bit later. I'll spend all my time working on these as I need to get some new products out.

Mark

[rreimund]

Mark,

Just to reiterate what I had said in another related post when I first saw you mention developing your own MAF Conversion.

I would absolutely be interested in it. I already have the EAT chip, and knowing that my previous purchase won't go completely to waste (given I can recoup 80% of that with the rebate) just further sweetens the deal. I know that the EAT Chip alone really transformed my car, and I'm sure that the added driveability and throttle response will further transform it yet again.

I may not be ready to move on it as soon as you release it, but rest assured that saving for it will be my priority once my front end is rebuilt (which should actually be in the next month).

Best Regards, and Thank you.
- Rick

[Martin in Bellevue]

..The price will be around $700 - $750..
Didn't Bruno sell 1 Modern Performance maf kit to Jeff at about $550? I bought my maf kit from Modern Perf directly, before Bruno had them available.
I'm not too impressed with the newer maf sensors on bmw's. I've replaced the costly bugger's on the x5 & the e36 m3 already. My brother's e39 540 had a maf sensor fail recently too. Check the dealer prices for a good laugh.
I have ditched the afm as well as the busted pro m maf on my 535. I am using the split second psc-01 programmable map sensor. Like it mucho.

[Qube]

Ready and waiting. My tax refund won't hold out forever ;)

[nixter]

Would there be any sense in an application for the M5? Or is that system already fine tuned enough as it is? If there was the possiblity for some extra low end I'd be all over it.

n

[MarkD]

Would there be any sense in an application for the M5? Or is that system already fine tuned enough as it is? If there was the possiblity for some extra low end I'd be all over it.

n

I've been thinking of making a conversion for the E34 M5 only because the hot wire MAF that's in there currently usually goes out of calibration after 100K km's and it's expensive to replace. At least I have two 93 M5's in my driveway to develop that conversion on.

If you want some better performance with the M5, get one of my chips.

[nixter]

I've been thinking of making a conversion for the E34 M5 only because the hot wire MAF that's in there currently usually goes out of calibration after 100K km's and it's expensive to replace. At least I have two 93 M5's in my driveway to develop that conversion on.

If you want some better performance with the M5, get one of my chips.


Already have one! Awaiting your MAF conversion ;)

[MarkD]

Mark,

Just to reiterate what I had said in another related post when I first saw you mention developing your own MAF Conversion.

I would absolutely be interested in it. I already have the EAT chip, and knowing that my previous purchase won't go completely to waste (given I can recoup 80% of that with the rebate) just further sweetens the deal. I know that the EAT Chip alone really transformed my car, and I'm sure that the added driveability and throttle response will further transform it yet again.

I may not be ready to move on it as soon as you release it, but rest assured that saving for it will be my priority once my front end is rebuilt (which should actually be in the next month).

Best Regards, and Thank you.
- Rick

Hi Rick,

thanks for the interest. The M30 MAF kit will take a bit of time to develop but I just talked to Qube and he's agreed to come over and let me use his car for a few hours at a time. My guess is that this may be ready in late June. I'll let everyone know as soon as it's ready, and post progress reports here also. Our first test session won't be till next week and at that time I'll see what's required to mount the MAF in an M30.

Mark

[MarkD]

Didn't Bruno sell 1 Modern Performance maf kit to Jeff at about $550? I bought my maf kit from Modern Perf directly, before Bruno had them available.
I'm not too impressed with the newer maf sensors on bmw's. I've replaced the costly bugger's on the x5 & the e36 m3 already. My brother's e39 540 had a maf sensor fail recently too. Check the dealer prices for a good laugh.
I have ditched the afm as well as the busted pro m maf on my 535. I am using the split second psc-01 programmable map sensor. Like it mucho.

I expect my system to be better than the Pro-M one. I think they also went out of business didn't they?

The Bosch Generation 4 MAF's are unreliable but I'm not using one of those.

[nixter]

What would you expect from a conversion on the M5? Similar results as with the other e34 engines?

[MarkD]

What would you expect from a conversion on the M5? Similar results as with the other e34 engines?

No, since the M5 already has a MAF the results won't be as dramatic.

It would be an option to install if your OEM MAF was faulty but I doubt I'd change a perfectly good one. I'll experiment with this on my cars but it's not going to be high priority for release. I want to release kits for the s14, s38 and m42 first. But it may get done out of that sequence since I have access to the cars.

[MTechnik540i]

I've been working on a MAF conversion and have a prototype which should be in production in June. I have it running on a 3.2l Metric mechanic M20 and will adapt it to the M30 also.

Each version will come with a custom EAT chip for the specific motor.

Here are a few pictures:
http://rides.webshots.com/album/558726438RfkIha

The M20 now has much improved throttle response and driveability. You can actually accellerate from 1200 rpm in 3rd or 4th gear.

MarkD

Very much so!

I've been going back and forth trying to decide on the Miller system, but I'm impressed with how clean your system looks from those pictures.

...and of course, the claim that you use a better MAF makes your's all the more enticing.

[digger]

Mark,

I know the purpose of the MAF is more than added torque and power but what sort of % gains do you expect to see at the low end, midrange, topend for the MM3200, don't worry we won't hold you to it........lol? I run a very similar spec engine so i am really keen to see what your system can do!

Cheers

[RockJock]

interesting thread ..... i just stumbled across it a second ago ...


Their system looks very similar to what Autothority sold back about 20 years ago. ;)

and from a previous post on this thread:

snip .....

But they use a cheap Ford MAF with 1989 technology in it. I'm using a pretty pricey MAF with a fast response time.

i don't know anything about MAFs but I'm kinda curious, did you reverse-engineer one of Miller's MAFs? or do they publish enough info on their website for one to deduct this?

[winfred]

it's not hard to spot that old ass ford maf, the only good thing about it is the junk yards are full of them if it takes a ****


i don't know anything about MAFs but I'm kinda curious, did you reverse-engineer one of Miller's MAFs? or do they publish enough info on their website for one to deduct this?

[Martin in Bellevue]

that and their proprietary chip was the reasons i wasn't in love with the miller after i saw it the first time
Miller's proprietary chip is the reason I bought in. Remember, the modern performance piggyback died on me (and Joe Shaw as well.) The salesguys at split second knew less than anything useful about their own piggybacks. I was quoting the manual to the guy last week & finally gave up trying to get some referential coefficient values for additional signal inputs to the map box. Temperature (& altitude) fluctuations really played up with that thing. That chip & the vendor's willingness to tune seem good enough for me. I could have spent half as much & gotten another split second box, according to their sales guys, but they couldn't provide fuel curves without selling me another maf sensor. :(

[RockJock]

it's not hard to spot that old ass ford maf, the only good thing about it is the junk yards are full of them if it takes a ****

i'm guessing it's the part numbers:

1L3F-12B579-AB
AFH90-02
5J07

... but isn't this off the 2001-2004 ford lightnings? are the contained electronics identical to the ones from the late eighties?

[MarkD]

Mark,

I know the purpose of the MAF is more than added torque and power but what sort of % gains do you expect to see at the low end, midrange, topend for the MM3200, don't worry we won't hold you to it........lol? I run a very similar spec engine so i am really keen to see what your system can do!

Cheers

Hi Digger,

I just saw your post now. That's a hard question to answer. I expect it will be better than my chip alone at WOT, and with better throttle response at part throttle than just my chip. The PT performance will be hard to measure on most dyno's, but you can definitely feel it.


Mark

[MarkD]

Miller's proprietary chip is the reason I bought in. Remember, the modern performance piggyback died on me (and Joe Shaw as well.) The salesguys at split second knew less than anything useful about their own piggybacks. I was quoting the manual to the guy last week & finally gave up trying to get some referential coefficient values for additional signal inputs to the map box. Temperature (& altitude) fluctuations really played up with that thing. That chip & the vendor's willingness to tune seem good enough for me. I could have spent half as much & gotten another split second box, according to their sales guys, but they couldn't provide fuel curves without selling me another maf sensor. :(


Martin,

is the Miller system running on your car now? How is it?

Mark

[MarkD]

interesting thread ..... i just stumbled across it a second ago ...



and from a previous post on this thread:

snip .....


i don't know anything about MAFs but I'm kinda curious, did you reverse-engineer one of Miller's MAFs? or do they publish enough info on their website for one to deduct this?

Both. I've been around long enough to remember the Autothority products from the late 80's early 90's. I also had a chance to look at a Miller MAF for the s38. It made the car run very rich, (10:1 at idle, PT etc) and the motor didn't run well at all. I had a look at the chip and it had the Autothority copyright in it. (looks for scratches head icon)....

The Miller MAF is not on that s38 now, it uses one of my chips. ACtually, the funny thing was thatthe car ran better with the Miller MAF and my chip, but ran even better with my chip alone! The results were measured on a dyno and MillerMAF + EAT chip had ~ 13 hp more than the Miller MAF and their chip.

[Martin in Bellevue]

Martin,

is the Miller system running on your car now? How is it?

MarkI'm waiting for delivery. I am curious that I may be Miller's first customer to use the miller maf with a wideband o2 sensor. Hoping for no surprises.
I gave up on the split second map box because of 1 specific tuning issue on long gradual hills on the highway (& their unwillingness to help with any technical support.)

[Qube]

I'm going to get the emissions test before we start any work, Mark ;)

[BFEINZIMER]

Mark...so I took off my AFM to clean it yesterday..turned out well now I want my MAF from you!!

Also since your doing the work, you should do sumthing like stamp an E34 on top of it or something nifty!

[RockJock]

Both. I've been around long enough to remember the Autothority products from the late 80's early 90's. I also had a chance to look at a Miller MAF for the s38. It made the car run very rich, (10:1 at idle, PT etc) and the motor didn't run well at all. I had a look at the chip and it had the Autothority copyright in it. (looks for scratches head icon)....

The Miller MAF is not on that s38 now, it uses one of my chips. ACtually, the funny thing was thatthe car ran better with the Miller MAF and my chip, but ran even better with my chip alone! The results were measured on a dyno and MillerMAF + EAT chip had ~ 13 hp more than the Miller MAF and their chip.

thanks Mark - i think i'll wait for one of your units ....

[digger]

Mark,

how are the M20 MAF kits going, any new on the release date?

What size is the OD of the exit of the MAF (in mm)? I am making a custom elbow so i need to know the OD of the MAF to know the ID required for the elbow.

What type of airbox will the M20 MAF mount up to? Will it fit a std m20 airbox or will a custom one be required? What is the inlet size of the M20 MAF? Is the unit longer than a M20/M30 AFM (so i know what size there is to work with)

Cheers

[Atl530i]

Hey Mark,

Are you making this kit just for the M30B35 or more than that. I have an E12 with the M30B28 that I would like to do the conversion to.

Thanks

Justin Murray

[BFEINZIMER]

mark...update?

[ThoreauHD]

Sign me up for one. I realize that the 530 V8 would be last on the list, but I'll wait.

[misfortune]

Sign me up for one. I realize that the 530 V8 would be last on the list, but I'll wait.
uhh doesn't the 530 use a MAF?

[digger]

Mark, hope your feeling better!

how are things coming along with the different MAF kits?

[MarkD]

Mark, hope your feeling better!

how are things coming along with the different MAF kits?

I was going to post tommorrow as I have to leave for Mopsort racetrack soon, I have to go tune a Euro s50b30 racecar on the track.


Courtney (who works at Metric Mechanic) has a 735i with a 5 speed and he's helping me out on this since it's hard to easily find a car here. I had an offer of one from Qube but it's still hard to use his on a regular basis.

I'll be getting the adapters I nned to connect the MAF to the M30 intake soon, and I'll do some remote tuning on Court's car. Once it looks good I'll ask Qube if his car is available. This might still be able to get released in mid to late October.

Court has had it running on his for 4 days and it's looking very promising.

Mark

[BFEINZIMER]

I was going to post tommorrow as I have to leave for Mopsort racetrack soon, I have to go tune a Euro s50b30 racecar on the track.


Courtney (who works at Metric Mechanic) has a 735i with a 5 speed and he's helping me out on this since it's hard to easily find a car here. I had an offer of one from Qube but it's still hard to use his on a regular basis.

I'll be getting the adapters I nned to connect the MAF to the M30 intake soon, and I'll do some remote tuning on Court's car. Once it looks good I'll ask Qube if his car is available. This might still be able to get released in mid to late October.

Court has had it running on his for 4 days and it's looking very promising.

Mark


nice :) cant wait!!

[BigKriss]

whoo hoo!

[Qube]

nice :) cant wait!!

Yep, anytime. Hope you got the OD measurements I sent.

[MarkD]

Yep, anytime. Hope you got the OD measurements I sent.


I did, but I don't have a lathe to make an adapter. Court at MM has made one and is going to make two more which he will ship to me. After we have this working well on his car, I'll set it up on your car.

Mark

[MarkD]

Hey Mark,

Are you making this kit just for the M30B35 or more than that. I have an E12 with the M30B28 that I would like to do the conversion to.

Thanks

Justin Murray

What ECU is in that car? If it's a Jetronic, I can't easily make a MAF conversion for it. Each conversion requires a special chip that takes many hours to develop, so if I don't think it's going to sell at least 20 units, I can't develop that version till later (if at all)

[s4martin]

Hi did you get the MAF conversion running for the M30? I'm really interested in doing this conversion on my '89 E34.

[mattyp]

Hi Mark

Put me down +1 :)

I've got the m30b35 in my '91 E34 and am keen to go the MAF + Chip combo when it's ready.

Cheers,

Matt.

[sneekens]

I've been working on a MAF conversion and have a prototype which should be in production in June. I have it running on a 3.2l Metric mechanic M20 and will adapt it to the M30 also.

Each version will come with a custom EAT chip for the specific motor.

Here are a few pictures:
http://rides.webshots.com/album/558726438RfkIha

The M20 now has much improved throttle response and driveability. You can actually accellerate from 1200 rpm in 3rd or 4th gear.

MarkD


very interested with this, together with your chip. but how much would it cost?

[BigKriss]

probably it won't be released for quite a while, if ever.

http://www.e30tech.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64071

[Arny535]

probably it won't be released for quite a while, if ever.

http://www.e30tech.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64071

I'm very sorry to hear that.
I'm planning to get an EAT chip for my 535i when I finish its engine overhaul. However, i was hoping I could also get a MAF kit.

Arny

[uscharalph]

How many of these did you actually ship? For the M20? For the M30?

[BigKriss]

I think zero, but there is an alternative anyway.

http://www.bimmernut.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40572


How many of these did you actually ship? For the M20? For the M30?