So I dipped a paw in the Diesel tank... (Pictures)

[Ferret]

... and had a look at some things.

Popped the cap off the sender arrangement in the boot of the tourer and had a look at what lies beneath. (I was bored lol and wanted to have a nosey at the air in the fuel problem.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/Car/1.jpg

Yanked the whole assembly out of the tank to inspect, interestingly the diesel pump sits in its own housing at the bottom of the tank, not sure if the petrol one does the same thing? Had to go fishing in the tank to get at it.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/Car/2.jpg

The bit that's causing all the air in fuel problem and bad diesel idle is marked number 1 in the following picture, a little f'cking O-Ring.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/Car/3.jpg

[Ferret]

This pipe slots into a feeder pipe in the bracket half way up the side of the tank - which runs down to the bottom of the tank. (Marked 2)

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/Car/4.jpg

When the tank goes under 1/4 full, this joint is no longer submerged and air can be drawn in through the buggered O-Ring. I'm gonna hit the nearest dealer to get the exact part required, diesel resistant and all, as it'll only cost a few pence and be the exact fit.

While I was under there, I stuck the multimeter across the pump terminals and discovered that the pump itself is good. Fires up correctly, but I think it might be worn to it's servicable limit, as if you look carefully at the above picture you can see metal shavings in the bottom of the tank right under where the pump entrance is positioned.

I'll replace both parts :)

If you've got a diesel and there's air in the line I suggest you change that O-ring and see what happens. The car is now starting a lot better from just having disturbed the pump and reseated the o-ring.
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/Car/5.jpg

[bigtisas]

No diesel car is allowed in California. Dame..

[Jehu]

diesel owners are sooooo selfish, spewing all that crap just to save themselves a few pennies... lol when i'm King of the World I will ban all trucks and launch them into the Sun!

[Barney Paull-Edwards]

This pipe slots into a feeder pipe in the bracket half way up the side of the tank - which runs down to the bottom of the tank. (Marked 2)

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/4.jpg

When the tank goes under 1/4 full, this joint is no longer submerged and air can be drawn in through the buggered O-Ring. I'm gonna hit the nearest dealer to get the exact part required, diesel resistant and all, as it'll only cost a few pence and be the exact fit.

While I was under there, I stuck the multimeter across the pump terminals and discovered that the pump itself is good. Fires up correctly, but I think it might be worn to it's servicable limit, as if you look carefully at the above picture you can see metal shavings in the bottom of the tank right under where the pump entrance is positioned.

I'll replace both parts :)

If you've got a diesel and there's air in the line I suggest you change that O-ring and see what happens. The car is now starting a lot better from just having disturbed the pump and reseated the o-ring.
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/5.jpg
If it turns out that you`ve found the problem then come down here for the beer!Pass on the part number for the `O` ring please.As for not being allowed diesels in la-la land,more fool them. By the way, your thread on diff ratios was interesting,accounts for top speed being higher than declared by BM,with that ratio any increase in revs would have a big differenc,mine pulls 4950.

[Barney Paull-Edwards]

What crap? Particulate filters work,lower cost of refining etc,and we get 35-48mpg,may be a few pennies to you but its pounds to me,AND the old oil from the sump keeps my house warm thanks,oh, and mine will lap the ring at 9`28",better than a 540 on a dry day!

[Ferret]

If it turns out that you`ve found the problem then come down here for the beer!Pass on the part number for the `O` ring please.As for not being allowed diesels in la-la land,more fool them. By the way, your thread on diff ratios was interesting,accounts for top speed being higher than declared by BM,with that ratio any increase in revs would have a big differenc,mine pulls 4950.

Barney,

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/fuel.jpg

Part 8, less than $1US - should fix the whole problem I think.

[repenttokyo]

No diesel car is allowed in California. Dame..


european diesel fuel has a much lower sulphur content.

[Barney Paull-Edwards]

Solid gold! That makes forum worthwhile. Thanks and you know where to come for beer,or channel ferry tickets.

[winfred]

bite me! i've been sporting da truck for the last week or two while the e30 sits awaiting cheaper gas, at the moment the truck is cheaper to drive despite the fact that it gets around 7 mpg less then the e30, diesel is 40-50 cents a gallon less then super, not too long ago they were about the same price

and yes if i want to i can single handedly deplete the ozone layer and smite tailgater's at will, one of these days i gotta take a pic of a good soot cloud, depending on how i have the afc set this is about like mine cept i have duals for full coverage, but i can shut down 4 lanes of traffic if i set it full loose http://members.cox.net/wdixon27/smokeout.gif http://video.thedieselgarage.com/category/Smoke/1/13c10e15-e570-47ae-9647-98d100f48156.htm


diesel owners are sooooo selfish, spewing all that crap just to save themselves a few pennies... lol when i'm King of the World I will ban all trucks and launch them into the Sun!

[calibra]

Hi sorry to jump on an old post, its my first post here im a 525tds (m51) owner with the hard to start prob iv been looking all over the net for a fix or just some info and it looks like Ferret has found it for me but theres a few things i want to check before i go get a new pump.

1. how do i test the old pump (i have done an ear test and cant hear it working)

2. how do i test the wiring to the pump (i have pluged in a MM and got a volt of 17.something off the middle wire but that didnt mean much to me just something was there)

3. is there a one way valve in the fuel line because if i park the car uphill it will not start for love nor money but if i turn it round and face down it will start :S

thanks for any help here guys this prob has been killing me for some time

BTW im in the uk (london) does anyone know somewhere good to get parts (fuel pump)

cheers

[Ferret]

Hi sorry to jump on an old post, its my first post here im a 525tds (m51) owner with the hard to start prob iv been looking all over the net for a fix or just some info and it looks like Ferret has found it for me but theres a few things i want to check before i go get a new pump.

1. how do i test the old pump (i have done an ear test and cant hear it working)

2. how do i test the wiring to the pump (i have pluged in a MM and got a volt of 17.something off the middle wire but that didnt mean much to me just something was there)

3. is there a one way valve in the fuel line because if i park the car uphill it will not start for love nor money but if i turn it round and face down it will start :S

thanks for any help here guys this prob has been killing me for some time

BTW im in the uk (london) does anyone know somewhere good to get parts (fuel pump)

cheers

Yikes, old thread alert!

Whatever you do, dont do what one of the guys off the uk bmw forums did and fit a petrol pump to it :D

He was blowing fuel lines like you wouldnt believe and couldnt understand it...

Since I wrote this I understand there are two further problems that could be causing it.

Firstly the injection pump has a lid on the top of it - the seal between the pump lid and the pump body tends to go ****up and allows the fuel to return to the tank by letting air in.

Secondly if the little rubber drain hoses between the injectors start to leak - they leak in reverse - they let air back in when the system's shut down and then you've got a problem.

Diesel vehicle fuel leaks are almost always in reverse - they leak air into the system seeing as the fuel moves through the lines under lower than atmospheric pressure.

I'd advise the following:
Take the lid off your diesel injection pump, get a new seal for it first - and apply haematite to both sides of the seal as you clamp it down.

Get yourself two non-return valves fuel graded. Fit one as close to the injection pump as you can possibly get it - if the other just out of the tank.

Change the o-ring in the tank.

I'll adjust the picture links in the morning so they work... and quickly write up something so that you can test the pump :)

[calibra]

Great stuff thanks Ferret ill do those things, i have already changed the small pipes on the injectors it was one of the first things that hit me and they were falling apart but still had the up hill prob (better starting down hill)

With any luck ill get back from work in day light tomorrow and open the tank up and have a look see, the non return valve is a sod to find asked around but no ones seems to have them :(

Pictures and test info would be great thanks :D

cheers

[calibra]

little update fuse 23 has power running so im thinking its the relay or the pump only thing is i have no idea what one is the pump relay can anyone point me to it
cheers

[Ferret]

little update fuse 23 has power running so im thinking its the relay or the pump only thing is i have no idea what one is the pump relay can anyone point me to it
cheers

Open the E-Box (right hand side opposite the fusebox)

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a190/Ferret101/Car/IMG_8182.jpg

See the white relay, it's supposed to be the orange one in the socket next to it... mine was removed in this photo.

[calibra]

thanks ferret just checked it and its clicking so im guessing its working so now im down to a short in the wires or a duff pump do you know what wires on the pump plug are for the pump and what ones are for the fuel sender

cheers for the help

[calibra]

Ok found a few bits in the bentley manual for testing pump and relay going to make the fused tool tonight and test tomorrow wish me luck
BTW
found out some prices for pumps
euro parts = £97 + vat im sure
Bmw = £128 would guess that was + vat
so for around £30 think i'd go with bmw thought they would be like £300 lol

[calibra]

Hi all anther little up date

change the seal on the tank and the car does start better but the pump still doesnt work, i check the relay crossed pins 30 and 87 and check the volts for the pump (pins 4 and 5) and got a volt of 6.5v to 7v seems a little low to me but i dont know what it should be can anyone help with what volts the pump should be getting

cheers for any help

[Barney Paull-Edwards]

The pump DOES work! Your problem may be filter, change it.Try turning the key at least four times(lighton,off),you may have my problem of bio bugs in the tank,when you did the "O" ring, was the pump housing black and filthy?? If so, problem is bugs, if not its valve top.When tank is low do you get air in filter to pump line? When you change filter dont gorilla filter,hand tight by normal person, mine cracked filter head due to me being gorilla!

[calibra]

Hi thanks for reply

I dont think the pump is working i cant hear or see anything to make me think it is.
I couldnt see any bugs in the tank looks ok bit of gunk built up around the pump inlet. The filter was changed about 500 miles ago only done it up by hand and have taken it off in the last week just to see if fuel was in it but i might change it again just in case.
These bugs if i do have something like that how do i kill them (flush the tank)

Only thing with the pump is i dont know how many volts it should run on if its 6 to 7 volts then im ok but if it should be 12volts i need to find out where the other 5'ish volts are, or if i try pumping 12 volts to the pump iv got and its not meant to have that much would i kill it

thanks for the help all

[Ferret]

Revived Photos for calibra

[calibra]

Cheers dude :D

[calibra]

Had a good look at the pictures thanks again ferret its true i picture can tell a thousand words (think thats how it goes)

just one thing i see in the last pic you are testing the plug but it doesn't look like your testing pin 4 and 5 are you testing the power to the pump or something else?

cheers