Trans Program!!!! Pls Help!!!!!!!

[salasng127]

Hi, everyone. My name is Eric. I bought my 1995 BMW 540i last year with 73000 miles on it. It is about 76000 miles now. Unfortunately, “TRANS PROGRAM” popped up on the dashboard lately. The message popped up mostly when I was on highway and it was usually after about 10 minutes of driving ( first five mins was on local ). About five times it happened when I made a lane change on freeway. One time it happened when I was in local making a left turn. It happened almost every time I went onto freeway. It happened couple times when I was just accelerating when merging onto the freeway. I think it happened 8 out of 10 times I used my car. I brought my car to dealer couple weeks ago. Here is the result on the invoice I got from him. “Ran short test and retrieved fault code 100 (speed monitoring) stored in EGS. Verified the transmission shift quality was poor. Checked transmission fluid – burnt. Recommend replacing transmission to correct internal wear.” He recommended me to have the transmission replaced for $6900 (don’t know if the labor is already included in the price) and I declined it.” Is it that bad that I need to have it replaced? Any suggestions?
Here are some more information that may help:
1. The rpm that shown on board is 500 when my car stops. Is that supposed to be 500 or 1000?
2. Here is how the trans program first happened: I checked the engine oil that morning. The dip stick was kinda stuck. I had to push my fingers onto the mount pretty hard to pull the rod out. I don’t know if that has something to do with the problem here.
Thank you for reading and hopefully you guys can help me save my $6900.

[94_e34_525i]

I personally dont know much about this particular problem cuz i havent had it (thank god), but it seems more common on the 540's, it seems like a classic case of the previous owner abusing the car. there is a wealth of info on this forum about this subject, did you try searching before?

[bmwrp8]

hi eric and welcome. First i'm not that familiar with 540 but mine the normal idle is 750rpm and about your trans program message click here this is very helpful site http://bmwe34.net/e34main/trouble/TransProgram.asp

[Evan]

You're in luck. There are many posts for you to read to gather info...

search for "trans program" and "kirt koeller"

You checking the oil had nothing to do with the problem... you most likely need a transmission fluid and filter service... others have fixed the error message by changing solenoids.

The secret is to do your due diligence and isolate the problem with the help of the members of this board and a local professional.

$6900? Don't sweat it.. you'll fix this one for a few hundred and a few hours of your time.

[salasng127]

Do you guys think that the fault code 100 (speed monitoring) may have something to do with it?
I actually did go here before --> http://bmwe34.net/e34main/trouble/TransProgram.asp
But I don't know how to fix car at all so I don't want to mess with the wires to cause more problem. So I am coming here and trying to get the exact solution so I can bring it to someone to fix it.
I actually had the transmission fluid changed last year, it was done by my cousin who is a mechanic.

[yaofeng]

I have a good 5 speed slush box in my garage collecting dust. Give me an offer I can't refuse.

[salasng127]

I'll let you know if I really need one.... thanks for your offer..
I am a little worried now because i am going to San Francisco tomorrow. That means I am going to see a lot of uphills and downhills.. I am afraid the car cannot go uphills if trans program is on. My main concern is when my car is completely stopped and need to accerlerate to go uphill.. did anyone have this experience before? any suggestions?

[Tiger]

I highly recommend you don't drive your car anymore unitl it is fixed. More driving will kill it and will cost you $6900. Take a different car or rent a car.

What ATF fluid did your cousin put in the trannY?

Car is supposed to idle at 500RPM.

It is probably just the speed sensor that need to be changed.

[whiskychaser]

Do you guys think that the fault code 100 (speed monitoring) may have something to do with it?
I actually did go here before --> http://bmwe34.net/e34main/trouble/TransProgram.asp
But I don't know how to fix car at all so I don't want to mess with the wires to cause more problem. So I am coming here and trying to get the exact solution so I can bring it to someone to fix it.
I actually had the transmission fluid changed last year, it was done by my cousin who is a mechanic.
Dont know what gearbox you have but code 100 often means:
trans/engine ratio not correct for gear selected or
speed sensor signal faulty or
slip in transmission too high
Because of the burnt fluid your garage is going with option 3 - put a new one in and solve the problem. Good luck with the problem but bear in mind Yoefeng's offer. And no, we are not related :)

[salasng127]

Dont know what gearbox you have but code 100 often means:
trans/engine ratio not correct for gear selected or
speed sensor signal faulty or
slip in transmission too high
Because of the burnt fluid your garage is going with option 3 - put a new one in and solve the problem. Good luck with the problem but bear in mind Yoefeng's offer. And no, we are not related :)

option 3?? did u mean slip in transmission too high??
So does the burnt transmission fluid cause the slip??
I dont know what "slip in Transmission too high" really means.. but i assume that it might be my problem.. The trans program msessage popped up when I hit the gas a little too hard when changing lane.. If I make smooth turn, it doesnt happen. Am I right at all?? :(

[salasng127]

I highly recommend you don't drive your car anymore unitl it is fixed. More driving will kill it and will cost you $6900. Take a different car or rent a car.

What ATF fluid did your cousin put in the trannY?

Car is supposed to idle at 500RPM.

It is probably just the speed sensor that need to be changed.

Speed sensor... which means I need to change what parts? thx

[whiskychaser]

option 3?? did u mean slip in transmission too high??
So does the burnt transmission fluid cause the slip??
I dont know what "slip in Transmission too high" really means.. but i assume that it might be my problem.. The trans program msessage popped up when I hit the gas a little too hard when changing lane.. If I make smooth turn, it doesnt happen. Am I right at all?? :(
Unfortunately the burnt fluid is probably caused by the transmission slip. There is small 'computer' called an EGS which monitors how fast drive is coming into and out of the gearbox. If the difference is not what it expects(ie too much 'slip') it drops you into a 'safe' mode to get you home. You can check the speed sensors and the motorised valves that are inside the gearbox using a multimeter at the EGS ECU inside your car. I'd start by getting the details of your gearbox off the manuf plate on the side of it and research that and trans program threads.

[Tiger]

Just call Kirt Koeller... you can find his number by doing a search. I had my valve body rebuilt by him. He is the ZF expert.

[salasng127]

"Unfortunately the burnt fluid is probably caused by the transmission slip." --> does that mean that even if I change the transmission fluid only and not do anything else, the trans program may be solved fro a while but it will come back when it is burnt again?!

[salasng127]

Just call Kirt Koeller... you can find his number by doing a search. I had my valve body rebuilt by him. He is the ZF expert.

Kirt Koeller is in East Coast and I am in West coast. There is no way I can bring my car to him...:(

[Tiger]

Actually he is in Michigan... that's not quite East Coast. As for your tranny fluid, all old fluid will smell funny as in burnt... is very subjective. Again, you never answered my question on what ATF fluid your cousin put in the car.

[RobPatt]

I don't mean to be an "a-hole" here, really... so just consider a few things...

- you got a car that was really advanced when it was made, now it's got some age and some miles... which means either:
a) it's gonna cost you some good cash to keep it on the road....
b) you get lucky
c) you save the cash and learn to fix most common things yourself....

your choice. But I'm guessing you're looking for options towards item "C"...and if that's the case... well things take time. Time to post... time for the generous folks to reply... and time for you to spend reading your repair manuel... searching for similiar problems on this board...(trans prog pops up like weekly, at least...). MANY, if not ALL, have solved their trans prog issue one way or another.. depends on the car, situation, etc.

Point here is you can't expect a silver bullet perfect answer on the spot. Now give Kurt a call and he can give you some good advice and at least add a good bit to what you're already gleaning from others....

Again, not to be an ass....but you're not going to get a silver bullet on the dime like this..... be patient... work it...read, and chill.... like someone said, with a little time and a little money you'll get it fixed.

Cheers,
Rob.

[salasng127]

Actually he is in Michigan... that's not quite East Coast. As for your tranny fluid, all old fluid will smell funny as in burnt... is very subjective. Again, you never answered my question on what ATF fluid your cousin put in the car.

ya... I know I ignored that..sorry.. because my cousin and I had an argument after the fix, didn't talk to him since then..
btw, I don't smell anything funny even after a long drive..

[salasng127]

I don't mean to be an "a-hole" here, really... so just consider a few things...

- you got a car that was really advanced when it was made, now it's got some age and some miles... which means either:
a) it's gonna cost you some good cash to keep it on the road....
b) you get lucky
c) you save the cash and learn to fix most common things yourself....

your choice. But I'm guessing you're looking for options towards item "C"...and if that's the case... well things take time. Time to post... time for the generous folks to reply... and time for you to spend reading your repair manuel... searching for similiar problems on this board...(trans prog pops up like weekly, at least...). MANY, if not ALL, have solved their trans prog issue one way or another.. depends on the car, situation, etc.

Point here is you can't expect a silver bullet perfect answer on the spot. Now give Kurt a call and he can give you some good advice and at least add a good bit to what you're already gleaning from others....

Again, not to be an ass....but you're not going to get a silver bullet on the dime like this..... be patient... work it...read, and chill.... like someone said, with a little time and a little money you'll get it fixed.

Cheers,
Rob.

ya.. option c is what I am hoping for..
i'll give kurt a call or an email and see what he says..
thanks for your reply

[Tiger]

He never answer his email.

[Tiger]

It is not whether you smell funny or not... it is whether the tranny will self destruct with wrong tranny fluid.

[salasng127]

let me give some more info and see if that helps..
I dont know if my car is in limp mode when the trans program is on..
Because I have no problem accerlerating with freeway speed. it can go higher than 80mph. The only problem is when the car is completely stopped, it takes about 1.5 sec to accerlerate to regular speed when on flat ground. takes even longer time in 30 degree slope.. never tried >45 degree slope with trans program message on though~ i am kinda scared that it wont even move.

[Tiger]

Did this happen before draining fluid?

[salasng127]

Did this happen before draining fluid?

before changing the fluid, it didn't happen.
It happened 2000 miles after i changed the fluid.
I think now what I will do is to do the fluid changed.
Do you guys know if transmission store does this service? and how much?

[Tiger]

Ha! Just as I suspected! You need to drain, and refill 2 times (drive 10 miles to see if it improves before doing second one) to be safe... Do not wait anymore.

Only fill with:
Pennzoil Multi-Vehicle ATF or
Castrol European Multi Vehicle ATF... top of my head...

DO NOT USE ANYTHING ELSE!

You can go to Jiffy Lube and have them do it right away with Pennzoil MultiVehicle ATF only.

We had a major discussion about the fluid... do a search under me and BillR.

If no change, then you are cooked.

[dennyg]

Let me know if you want to sell. I have a automatic from same yr. If your only option is 6900 it might be better to sell her.

[MBXB]

Make sure you have the correct fluid and fluid levels.
Then reboot the car. Search for the shogun reset.

[salasng127]

Ha! Just as I suspected! You need to drain, and refill 2 times (drive 10 miles to see if it improves before doing second one) to be safe... Do not wait anymore.

Only fill with:
Pennzoil Multi-Vehicle ATF or
Castrol European Multi Vehicle ATF... top of my head...

DO NOT USE ANYTHING ELSE!

You can go to Jiffy Lube and have them do it right away with Pennzoil MultiVehicle ATF only.

We had a major discussion about the fluid... do a search under me and BillR.

If no change, then you are cooked.

ha... why it is as you suspected... is it because the fluid went bad after about 2000 miles? is this normal if the wrong fluid is being changed?

Do you think I should buy the fluid myself then bring it to the store or just let the store do everything~?

[salasng127]

Make sure you have the correct fluid and fluid levels.
Then reboot the car. Search for the shogun reset.

Sorry, I dont know this term "shotgun reset".. can you please explain more?

[Tiger]

Wrong fluid will cause exactly the problem you have. Jiffy Lube is Pennzoil operated so everything Pennzoil sells, they have it.

[Tiger]

http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=2806&highlight=shogun+reset

[salasng127]

Wrong fluid will cause exactly the problem you have. Jiffy Lube is Pennzoil operated so everything Pennzoil sells, they have it.

cool... I'll do this service at jiffy lube then~
the store is only about 10 min drive from home, that means I dont need to go onto freeway and let the message pops up, even better....

[salasng127]

before I go, I would like to know how much I should expect they will charge me? I dont want them to charge extra

[Tiger]

Just do it.

[salasng127]

I called Jiffy lube today and they said they weren't able to do it because they can't check the level.. so I called the dealer and planned to do it there.
They recommended me to use synethetic ATF rather than Multi-vechicle ATF. Which one should I choose??
Also, they estimated the price to be $325 us dollars. Is it reasonable??
Any suggestions are welcome~~ thank you

[Tiger]

Those guy at Jiffy Lube is a smuck... there is two holes on the tranny... one on the side to drain the fluid out and there is one in the middle of the pan way up there... that one is the fill hole and to check for fluid when full while the car is idling...

Fill as much as possible... then start up engine and let idle... keep filling fluid until it comes back out heavily.... and that is when the tranny is full.

Just buck up and bring the car back to your cousin. $3.50 a quart compared to what dealer wants for thier oil... $30 a quart.

[salasng127]

I don't think I'll bring it to my cousin...:(
Do you think it is safe if I bring it to the private owned local store??
If not, will Ammco be a good choice? I kinda didn't want to bring it there because I was afraid they will make me buy their transmission~
Should I use multivechicle ATF or Synethetic ATF??
How long does the fluid change process take them??

[salasng127]

If I am buying the fluid myself, how many quarts should i buy?

[salasng127]

I was told by my uncle that the fluid my cousin changed is one of those expensive ones. It costed about 300 just for the fluid. I guess it is produced by BMW or something.
So I wonder if the problem is caused by fluid being too good?
Or is it just because something else is wrong that causes the fluid to burn?
The good news is pepboys estimated the fluid and filter service to be 150 while the bmw dealer estimated 325..
hopefuly the $150 will do what I expect~~

[pingu]

Presumably Pepboys won't be using the specified fluid type then?

There's a long post somewhere on this forum about the pros and cons of not using the specified (i.e. expensive) automatic transmission fluid. As far as I can remember, Penzoil make an ATF that they claim is suitable for the 5HP30 gearbox, and I also seem to recall that some people on this forum have used the Penzoil ATF with no problems.

[Tiger]

BillR already solved that problem. Everyone claims compatability. I have Pennzoil MV ATF in my car for 5 years... zero problem.

[Tiger]

Right now, I am not sure what ATF fluid you got in your car... You didn't have the problem until after he changed the fluid. Did you pay your cousin $300 for that fluid? How long did it take him to get that fluid? That stuff is special order and takes time to get them... no local supplier carries it.

Go ahead and let Pep Boys do the job. You got nothing to lose. Let them use Pennzoil MV ATF or the Castrol European ATF... the Castrol said it specifically on the bottle compatible with Shell LA2634.... You got to tell them when filling up the fluid... fill as much as possible without engine running... then with engine running continue to fill until they start coming back out... then just plug it up.

[MBXB]

I ordered a 12 pack from Ace:

http://www.amazon.com/ATF-MULTIVEHICLE-PENN-QT-PRODUCTS-PENNZOIL/dp/B000PHHGXW/ref=sr_1_70/105-5686329-0132403?ie=UTF8&s=automotive&qid=1185859047&sr=1-70

[salasng127]

Right now, I am not sure what ATF fluid you got in your car... You didn't have the problem until after he changed the fluid. Did you pay your cousin $300 for that fluid? How long did it take him to get that fluid? That stuff is special order and takes time to get them... no local supplier carries it.

Go ahead and let Pep Boys do the job. You got nothing to lose. Let them use Pennzoil MV ATF or the Castrol European ATF... the Castrol said it specifically on the bottle compatible with Shell LA2634.... You got to tell them when filling up the fluid... fill as much as possible without engine running... then with engine running continue to fill until they start coming back out... then just plug it up.

It took him about 10 days to do that and some other brake jobs.. my cousin used to work at a dealer place.. maybe that's why he could get it fast. I paid him $500 totally.
Okay, I'll let them know the procedure you gave me.. thanks

[salasng127]

I ordered a 12 pack from Ace:

http://www.amazon.com/ATF-MULTIVEHICLE-PENN-QT-PRODUCTS-PENNZOIL/dp/B000PHHGXW/ref=sr_1_70/105-5686329-0132403?ie=UTF8&s=automotive&qid=1185859047&sr=1-70

cool~ thanks~ I might buy that and get it to them~

[salasng127]

Presumably Pepboys won't be using the specified fluid type then?

There's a long post somewhere on this forum about the pros and cons of not using the specified (i.e. expensive) automatic transmission fluid. As far as I can remember, Penzoil make an ATF that they claim is suitable for the 5HP30 gearbox, and I also seem to recall that some people on this forum have used the Penzoil ATF with no problems.

I'll keep my fingers crossed~~:D

[salasng127]

I ordered a 12 pack from Ace:

http://www.amazon.com/ATF-MULTIVEHICLE-PENN-QT-PRODUCTS-PENNZOIL/dp/B000PHHGXW/ref=sr_1_70/105-5686329-0132403?ie=UTF8&s=automotive&qid=1185859047&sr=1-70

How many packs should I order~? 12 is enough?

[MBXB]

12 qts per case is more than enough. I think I used about 7-8 last time.
Nasty smelling stuff!

Here's a guide: http://www.e38.org/zf-5hp30-service.html

Print and hand it to the crew at Pepboys.

[Tiger]

Pep Boys has them in stock... and cheaper... Don't bother.

[Tiger]

Okay, let's assume he did the right job... and it cost you a ton... then don't flush it down the toilet.... There is a good possibility that your cousin didn't put enough in... use the guide that MXBX linked below... Have someone top it up.

You know... if you came up front with the entire story, we could have shaved alot of time and headaches.

[whiskychaser]

I just read 5 pages of this thread. I still dont know what box, what oil is in it now, if it was filled right or why you felt out with your cousin. :)

[Tiger]

Yeah I know... we really don't know what's in there... but ya know... you gotta give someone a benefit of doubt... At this point, I would want to check if it is filled correctly... low fluid level will cause slipping.

[salasng127]

my bad.. for not giving all the information...I did try to find the number of the box.. but couldn't find it maybe I searched it in the wrong place or something..
but I will definitely give you guys the result once I get the fluid done and test drive it. Hopefully no later than next week..

[salasng127]

12 qts per case is more than enough. I think I used about 7-8 last time.
Nasty smelling stuff!

Here's a guide: http://www.e38.org/zf-5hp30-service.html

Print and hand it to the crew at Pepboys.

I called pepboys today again because I was concerned about the filter change. They said the filter is a special order and costs 20 bucks.
On the guide that MBXB posted, it said "It's IMPERETIVE that only original (OEM) BMW filters with the word "FILTRAN" stamped on it be used". Should I make sure that the filter they change is the one with "FILTRAN" stamped on it? Is BMW picky on filter?

[Ross]

Stay away from Pep-Boys for BMW parts. Go to the dealer or order online if you have time.

[salasng127]

How about I order the filter from dealer or online and then bring it to pepboys?

[Tiger]

Just pick it up at the dealer and bring it to them.

[MBXB]

Got mine from the local BMW stealer.

[salasng127]

cool.. I just thought of another question just now...
Let's assume that my cousin filled the "expensive fluid", and the dealer lied to me about the fluid being burnt, for which I will ask the pepboys' mechanic to check the condition of the fluid and the level before changing it. So will it be safe if I just have them fill it up to the correct level using their fluid?

[salasng127]

Got mine from the local BMW stealer.
haha....stealer...very true
how mcuh did u pay?

[MBXB]

Don't remember the exact amount but it wasn't unreasonable.

[salasng127]

checked it with a local dealer.. $60 for the filter~
I forgot to ask this b4. If my cousin has changed the filter when he changed the fluid, is it necessary to change the filter this time?

[bmwrp8]

checked it with a local dealer.. $60 for the filter~
I forgot to ask this b4. If my cousin has changed the filter when he changed the fluid, is it necessary to change the filter this time?

WOW this thread has so many replies!! just change the ATF and filter and get it over with...:D if it didn't work its either you buy a 2nd hand tranny or have it rebuild. cheers:)

[salasng127]

Okay, guys~ I think I have good news~
I have it changed last weekend FINALLY...haha
But I should really say sorry to Tiger. Because I forgot to request for Pennzoil ATF. The fluid they drained in was D4 synthetic ATF. They are the local dealer which only does German cars (mostly Benz and BMW as I saw), so I think they know what fluid to drain in and D4 should be fine, what you guys think?
Right after the fluid changed, the mechanic told me that the trans program came up when he started the car immediately after the change. Why was that, guys? So when they brought out the car and they started the car again in front of me, this time the message didn't come up. Then they off the car and started again and it didn't come up either. So I just paid them and drove home feeling pretty upset. On the way back home, the gears shifted smoothly, the steering wheel were not as stiff as before when turning. It didn't have the "shake" when accelerating or changing lanes. And most importantly, the message didn't come up. It was a 15 min drive (5min local 10min highway). Before the fluid change, the problem usually came up after 10 min of driving.
I made two more trips on Sunday. The first one was a 30 min drive ( 15 min local and 15 min highway ), the second one was 15 min drive. HORRAY, they were both good and nothing went wrong~ I will make a 2.5-hour trip this week. So I'll give you guys an update on that.
thanks everyone who left message(s) to my question~ especially Tiger for giving so many advices.

so Now my questions are:
1. Why would the message come up right after the change? Was it because the car hadn't adapt to the fluid?
2. Will there be anything else I should do to my car for making sure?