BMW Coolant

[karl1171]

BMWe34.net says I must use BMW coolant when changing the coolant, or damage to the radiator or head gasket will occur!

Is this Correct? Why is this? Can I not use any coolant?

[Mitch90535im]

Yes.

Because of the formula.

No.

[DaveVoorhis]

Any modern, high-quality coolant rated for aluminium engines and meeting manufacturer's specs (check the bottle) is fine, but you must change it every two years.

[Paul in NZ]

, but you must change it every two years.
I believe this is the most important thing

[The Bigfella]

It ain't just the aluminium issue - there's also the plastic radiator. Wrong Ph will make the plastic brittle.

You can use engine oil in your radiator if you want - just don't ask me to warrant it. Use the right stuff and be done with it. Its cheap too.

[bmwrp8]

don't mean to hijack this thread but what about those radiator flush? is it worth it? or will it damage something?

[BMWCCA1]

This is silly. You can use BMW coolant if it makes you feel good and the price isn't beyond your means. I've heard the same stuff is available from SAAB for less. But to say without a doubt that there's an advantage to doing so, or that not doing so will cause problems is just not provable. Let's take the radiator argument; just check with the E39 guys who have as many failed radiators as anyone and yet many of these cars have been under BMW maintenance program all their lives getting BMW prescribed maintenance with BMW parts and fluids, at BMW dealers since new. The radiators still fail like clockwork.

I've been using brand-name DexCool equivalents in my BMWs since 1997 when a tech in our shop did an exhaustive search for proper coolant in a Ferrari owned by a chemical engineer that was suffering from corrosion in the water-cooled intake causing the gaskets to leak. All research, and contact with manufacturers, pointed to DexCool-type products as having the proper stuff (or rather not having the bad stuff) necessary for any aluminum engine, head, or block. For ten years I've added, topped up, drained and refilled with the cheapest brand-name DexCool from Walmart without any incident of sludge, corrosion, or disaster from mixing BMW coolant with DexCool. To be honest, I don't change coolant every two years though I would recommend it. I treat the DexCool the way I treated BMW coolant when I could get it practically for free at the dealership, and my three main daily-driver BMWs have 178,000, 220,000, and 128,000 miles. Even my Plymouth van has 200,000 miles. I inherited it at 88,000 with several coolant leaks and replaced the radiator around 150,000. I'm knocking on wood here just to be safe.

While I'm sure the BMW coolant is excellent, it's not the only coolant that will work in your BMW nor is it necessarily even the best, based on BMW's own failures in cooling system components. Though the radiator problems probably have more to do with their requirement to be recyclable than what coolant is in them. Personally, I'd stay away from Peak which ate some sensors in my '84 Toyota truck, but beyond that, as long as you stick with coolant specifically for aluminum engines, I don't think you're harming your car to save a couple of bucks. If you don't mind paying BMW prices, you're probably not causing any problems by using the BMW stuff, either. But then I fill up my cars at Kroger, too. Not Shell. Not Amoco. Two kids in college makes you watch every penny.

[bmwrp8]

im using prestone coolant for 2years, no issues so far

[BMWCCA1]

It's important to remember you don't want to use the basic, cheapest, antifreeze even if it says "safe for aluminum". That means you probably shouldn't use the green stuff. You want something that's specifically low-silicate, low-pH, and phosphate-free. Valvoline has a site where they discuss the various formulas of their Zerex brand coolant, including a formula that meets BMW OE requirements: http://www.valvoline.com/zerex/

Note that the BMW equivalent and the DexCool equivalent share many of hte same features:

Zerex BMW-approved Hybrid Organic Acid Technology (HOAT) chemistry:
• Utilizes hybrid organic acid technology to minimize inhibitor depletion
• Low-silicate, low-pH and phosphate-free formula
• Provides protection against liner pitting and corrosion
• Helps prevent rust and corrosion
• Protects all cooling system metals, including aluminum

Zerex DexCool equivalent:
• Organic Acid Technology (OAT) minimizes corrosion inhibitor depletion
• Patented formula contains no silicates, phosphates, borates, nitrates or amines
• Excellent rust and corrosion protection
• Protects all cooling system metals including aluminum

It's also interesting to note that DexCool is listed as indicated for VW/Audi and Porsche products from 1996-on, not the BMW-HOAT stuff. The DexCool version is available nearly everywhere. I've yet to run into their BMW-equivalent HOAT stuff to make a price comparison. Anyone seen it yet?

[winfred]

certain coolants contain plasticizers which break down the plastic when they get old, and the wonderful godlike bmw blue is one of them (when the neck snaps off the radiator or bottle crumbles you can see the intrusion into the plastic), ill see if i still have the info i posted a year or two ago that somewhat explains the different coolants and post it when i get home, bmw blue or dexcool will never grace my cars or anything in my shop, but if using factory blessed fluids blows your skirt up go for it, i hate these pissing match fluid threads and after posting the article from master tech tonight will only watch this one for my amusement


It ain't just the aluminium issue - there's also the plastic radiator. Wrong Ph will make the plastic brittle.

.

[charlie]

so what do you sue Winfred? I trust your opinion as should everyone else...


certain coolants contain plasticizers which break down the plastic when they get old, and the wonderful godlike bmw blue is one of them (when the neck snaps off the radiator or bottle crumbles you can see the intrusion into the plastic), ill see if i still have the info i posted a year or two ago that somewhat explains the different coolants and post it when i get home, bmw blue or dexcool will never grace my cars or anything in my shop, but if using factory blessed fluids blows your skirt up go for it, i hate these pissing match fluid threads and after posting the article from master tech tonight will only watch this one for my amusement

[BMWCCA1]

Yes, that might be helpful, unless you simply enjoy pissing matches! :)

Maybe how you arrived at your determination, too, would be useful. I feel certain you covered that previously.

Is it maybe here? http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=28147

[winfred]

that's it, i run and suggest name brand green stuff and change it every two years



Is it maybe here? http://www.bimmer.info/forum/showthread.php?t=28147

[whiskychaser]

I thought you could use any as long as it was blue :-(

[Barney Paull-Edwards]

Green! Its called Ethylene Glycol, buy it as that and it`ll last forever, no additives, plasticisers or whatever, end.

[whiskychaser]

Green! Its called Ethylene Glycol, buy it as that and it`ll last forever, no additives, plasticisers or whatever, end.
Just joking. Additives?-Willing to bet ethylene glycol doesnt start off life green. Never had a problem with antifreeze making plastic brittle. Nitric acid on the other hand is a bugger for it. Cant see a queue to top up with it though:)

[Barney Paull-Edwards]

The green in it was a trace colour for locating leaks,originally for R-R Merlin engines,all alloy but with iron/steel bits, does not corrode either.

[markus]

as long as its low silicate and phosphate it whould be ok right?

[Zeuk in Oz]

Have never understood the mania over this issue. Do a search if you want to see how often it comes up.

BMW blue is cheap and you only need 2 bottles (3 litres).

Use it and worry about something else that matters - like tyres.

[Jehu]

I recently had a BMW Dealership flush and refill my coolant system with BMW Blue. The next day the upper hose popped off and i lost 4/5th of what had just been put in. I wasn't in the BMW parking lot so needing to drive i bought the first bottle of 50/50 i could find,PEAK i think,Green for sure and have been using that and Prestone since. I was going to try having the dealership refill me but honestly couldn't be bothered. Everyone says the current Green Ethylene Glycol coolants are safe. I don't mind revisiting issues to distill the knowledge base further. How many times is White Lighting distilled?

[winfred]

depends on how hot ya want it, real shine is probably in the 180-190 proof range, pure alcohol would be 200 proof, the more times you run it through the coil the more clean it gets but i am not sure how close to pure you can get, unfortunately i never got to run off a batch with my grandad before he died, that would be one cool vocation to have tucked away


How many times is White Lighting distilled?

[BMWCCA1]

Have never understood the mania over this issue. Do a search if you want to see how often it comes up.

BMW blue is cheap and you only need 2 bottles (3 litres).
So, what does it cost you where you live?

[The Bigfella]

So, what does it cost you where you live?

Less than $20 Aus - call it US $17 to do the car.

[pingu]

Interestingly (or maybe not), it isn't possible to distill alcohol to purer than 95.6%. To remove the last few percent of water, the water needs to be remboved in some other way, e.g. by using a chemical (such as calcium oxide) to remove the water.

[bfd]

Less than $20 Aus - call it US $17 to do the car.

That's cheap. In the San Francisco Bay Area, where there are like 9 dealers, the price ranges from $22-30 PER GALLON (and the $22 price was for Mini brand coolant!). In contrast, SAAB "blue" coolant, which is Zerex G-48, sells for about $12 per gallon. I bought the SAAB.

[whiskychaser]

Interestingly (or maybe not), it isn't possible to distill alcohol to purer than 95.6%. To remove the last few percent of water, the water needs to be remboved in some other way, e.g. by using a chemical (such as calcium oxide) to remove the water.
I think maybe Winfred was talking in old money. It used to say 70 percent 'proof' on a bottle of whisky (+e for Irish). In fact it was about 40 per cent alcohol by volume (ABV) which is how its marked today. Speaking of which I need to freshen my drink.......:)

[BigKriss]

blue coolant and oil filters, they are the only cheap things at the $tealer.


Less than $20 Aus - call it US $17 to do the car.

[winfred]

unless something has changed since the days of yore 100 proof is 50% alcohol, 200 proof would be 100% pure, shine runs maybe 190 proof


I think maybe Winfred was talking in old money. It used to say 70 percent 'proof' on a bottle of whisky (+e for Irish). In fact it was about 40 per cent alcohol by volume (ABV) which is how its marked today. Speaking of which I need to freshen my drink.......:)

[chamilun]

peak global lifetime



J. Can I use PEAK Global LifeTime Antifreeze & Coolant in European and Asian manufactured automobiles?

Yes, PEAK Global LifeTime Antifreeze features an advanced patented technology that provides maximum rust and corrosion protection for cooling systems found in European and Asian automobiles. Additionally, the patented technology found in PEAK Global LifeTime Antifreeze meets the silicate-free coolant requirements of Asian car manufacturers and the phosphate-free requirements of European car manufacturers.

[ryan roopnarine]

I think maybe Winfred was talking in old money. It used to say 70 percent 'proof' on a bottle of whisky (+e for Irish). In fact it was about 40 per cent alcohol by volume (ABV) which is how its marked today. Speaking of which I need to freshen my drink.......:)

in america, which is the only way it is done :D proof is double percentage at 60f, which is the reason that it works out to double. in redcoat, modern tymes england measurement, it is also double, but originally the number was determined at 51f or such, which yields the 40:70 guideline.

[mamilapon]

Youre my man Zeuk!! Why experiment with other ****, just 2 bottles from Canterburry BMW =$24, no big deal!!

[whiskychaser]

in america, which is the only way it is done :D proof is double percentage at 60f, which is the reason that it works out to double. in redcoat, modern tymes england measurement, it is also double, but originally the number was determined at 51f or such, which yields the 40:70 guideline.
I was responding to Pingu's statement about producing alcohol more than 95.6% and assumed he thought Winfred meant ABV. Just from info, my Bells whisky went from being 70 pc proof to 40pc abv in the last twenty years. Exactly when is a bit hazy:)

[uscharalph]

Just spend the $$.

[ryan roopnarine]

I was responding to Pingu's statement about producing alcohol more than 95.6% and assumed he thought Winfred meant ABV. Just from info, my Bells whisky went from being 70 pc proof to 40pc abv in the last twenty years. Exactly when is a bit hazy:)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcoholic_proof

[BigKriss]

This is what we use down under.

"In the definition current in the United States of America, the proof number is twice the percentage of the alcohol content measured by volume at a temperature of 60 °F (15.5 °C). Therefore "80 proof" is 40% alcohol by volume (most of the other 60% is water), and pure alcohol would be "200 proof""

Proof is double alcohol by volume. most spirits are 37-40% alcohol by volume.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcoholic_proof

[whiskychaser]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A602939

An interesting article confirming UK old 70 proof = 40 abv. If you cant trust the BBC who can you trust? More interesting is the idea of mixing it with gunpowder! I kid you not:)