Auto gearboxes - fail more than manual gearboxes ? Opinion.

[repenttokyo]

they fail more often because they are under greater stress from heat.

[btc530d]

Well, this is my first post in here!

I plan to buy an used E39 530d Touring from 1999 and would like to know something about this:

Auto gearboxes fail more than manual gearboxes ?

Is this a myth or a reality ?

What is your opinion.

I am a little in doubt with this, cause i like manual, dont like very much auto but maybe i will have to consider also auto gearboxes....

So, i read a lot and all i see its people saying that auto gearboxes do fail more than manual and they need to be replaced for a new one, leading to a lot of money .........

What is your opinion about this ?:) :) :)
Thanks!

[repenttokyo]

If it is treated well and given good maintenance throughout, A/T will last longer than the M/T IMHO. i've never heard of an a/t that missed shift.. unlike with the m/t, there is an element of human error.. even if they say its the lifetime fluid tranny, they would also change it regularly but im not sure of when they would change it.. either at 30k mileage or so..


AT's often miss shifts, through slippage. I had one that would miss first all the time.

[sneekens]

If it is treated well and given good maintenance throughout, A/T will last longer than the M/T IMHO. i've never heard of an a/t that missed shift.. unlike with the m/t, there is an element of human error.. even if they say its the lifetime fluid tranny, they would also change it regularly but im not sure of when they would change it.. either at 30k mileage or so..

[rob101]

If it is treated well and given good maintenance throughout, A/T will last longer than the M/T IMHO. i've never heard of an a/t that missed shift.. unlike with the m/t, there is an element of human error.. even if they say its the lifetime fluid tranny, they would also change it regularly but im not sure of when they would change it.. either at 30k mileage or so..
good points.

They have friction wet clutches and brakes inside which burn out and also their debris can clog the valve blocks. which is why you have a filter inside "life time" ones, however once the clutches wear out what do you do? at least with a manual car the clutch is serviceable without opening the gearbox. it also keeps all the debris inside the belhousing NOT in the gearbox oil.
would say that a manual gearbox is more serviceable which is ultimately more important because they are pretty much as durable as each other in the long run.

[Dr_Snooz]

As a rule, Autos fail more than Manuals, but Manual clutches fail more than Autos. :)

[mattyb]

very valid and sensible perspective there Rob,

as for having to buy a new box when an auto fails thats rubbish, they can be rebuilt for a sensible cost in most cases. Like anything, dogs, women, cars etc its how you treat the equipment in the first place that determines the life span and operational quality.

[sneekens]

very valid and sensible perspective there Rob,

as for having to buy a new box when an auto fails thats rubbish, they can be rebuilt for a sensible cost in most cases. Like anything, dogs, women, cars etc its how you treat the equipment in the first place that determines the life span and operational quality.


+1. I agree. treat whichever tranny you have it will last a long time..

[Ferret]

+1. I agree. treat whichever tranny you have it will last a long time..

Transmission life is highly dependant on both driving style AND the vehicle useage - a vehicle with astronomical mileage on it and mainly highway driving will have a transmission on it that's almost spotless - and the clutch will still have lots of life on it too...

...if it's got 70k and has been used around town a lot, watch out for trouble shortly!

The guys on the UK boards are constantly moaning about E39 auto problems - which usually happen in the 70-100k mile range if they strike.

They're awesome gearboxes, just their reliability seems to be a bit crap!

[sneekens]

As a rule, Autos fail more than Manuals, but Manual clutches fail more than Autos. :)

manual gearbox fails if the manual clutch fails, right? wear and tear? I haven't seen a manual tranny last 250,000 kms without changing the clutch, pressure plate etc. but an auto tranny will, just by changing the fluid often and the filter occasionally, good maintenance with proper treatment. as a testament, a fellow forumer Ronald N. has 280,000kms on his 4hp22 and never had it overhauled, or changed anything internally or had slip issues.

or he is just lucky... :D

if the tranny does fail, the cost of overhauling an auto tranny is ~$350.00, which is not bad actually.:)


but i would agree that the manual tranny is easier to be serviced compared to an auto. meaning, no need to bring a manual tranny to the pros for simple servicing.:)

[repenttokyo]

It was broken.

exactly.

[Ross]

Overhaul an autobox for $350?? Please share the name of your trans builder.
The automatics are necessarily more complicated and failure prone than a manual gear box, add the electronics and the unfortunate fact that some asswipe at BMW decided to recommend never changing the fluid.
Anyone interested in a manual swap?

[Ross]

AT's often miss shifts, through slippage. I had one that would miss first all the time.
It was broken.

[sneekens]

Overhaul an autobox for $350?? Please share the name of your trans builder.
The automatics are necessarily more complicated and failure prone than a manual gear box, add the electronics and the unfortunate fact that some asswipe at BMW decided to recommend never changing the fluid.
Anyone interested in a manual swap?

well here in the PI, it will cost that much... anyways, it is AUTOMECHANIKA. They do service, Lambos, Porsche, bmw's, benz, jags, practically almost all european and some american cars... 10,000 sq.m of covered work space, complete tools and equipment. this company is supported by the germans who they bought their equipment from. And they carry ZF parts if you need them for rebuilding or replacing your power steering and auto tranny.

the e39 auto tranny does have electronic problems.. this sucks compared to the older e34.

[repenttokyo]

All indications are that the clutch in my '89 is original. The odo reads 256k miles and hasn't worked for 5 years. Estimated to be a bit past 300k.
Fingers crossed


clutch in my 91 is original,389 000 km.

[Ross]

All indications are that the clutch in my '89 is original. The odo reads 256k miles and hasn't worked for 5 years. Estimated to be a bit past 300k.
Fingers crossed

[whiskychaser]

All indications are that the clutch in my '89 is original. The odo reads 256k miles and hasn't worked for 5 years. Estimated to be a bit past 300k.
Fingers crossed
My experience is clutches on manuals (driven by all family members) last about 60k miles. My older son had a clutch go at 12k miles on his car. Ok it wasnt a new car-its a Corsa so maybe a driving school had it first! Coincidence or do we have a suspect?:D There is a lot of talk about the GM 4speed auto falling to bits but not too many problems with the 5 speed ZF. Another coincidence?

[Robert K]

I was having the "Trans Program" message pop up occasionally. It also would hang the downshift from second gear to first occasionally. However, it did have 160,000 miles on it and functioned perfectly most of the time. I really blame the faults with my transmission with the electronics. If it had been mechanical, it most likely would have happened all the time. My problems were intermittent. Having heard that the 4HP22 trannys were a bit fragile, I always kept the filter clean and changed about 3.5 quarts of fluid every 5-7,000 miles to keep it fairly fresh. Manuals on the other hand typically can last a long, long time if you don't miss shifts or grind gears. Same goes for the clutch. If you don't ride it at stoplights or abuse it in general, I'm sure it can last over 100,000 miles.

Robert K
BMW-less at the moment