For those of us who like to and *can* drive fast: "American Autobahn"

[Unregistered]

Do you agree or disagree?

http://www.americanautobahn.com/

[AllanS]

It'll never happen, and for a lot of good reasons other than "speed is dangerous". The driving instruction and testing in this country is simply not up to task. Any idiot can take a 5 minute "test", and bam, there's your license sir/madam. On the roads of NY, I see people doing the damnest, most idiotic things, putting other motorists and pedestrians at risk. Just today I witnessed:

-People parking their SUVs on the side of a ___one lane road___ to pick their kids up from private school.

-People pulling over on a 2 lane road, and opening their door into traffic from behind, without a single concern.

-Tailgating trucks (I can't stand this)

-Travelling 15mph under the posted limit for no apparent reason

-Blatent disregard for stopsigns, traffic lights, right of way, and use of blinkers

I witnessed this all in about 1hr of tooling around town in the morning and during lunch. On a recent road trip to Virginia for a friend's funeral, I could've filled up a small encyclopedia with the crap I witnessed.

If it was going to happen, just for argument's sake, I would like to see this:

For an autobahn type road to exist, you would need toll booth devices at each end of said stretches of road, to read some type of EZPass device, which denotates authorization to drive at such speeds. In order to get one, you would need to pass a 2 week (80hrs) driving course, covering high speed driving, defensive, poor weather, etc. conditions. This course would cost 5k$ for entry, and if you fail the end exam, you have to pay an additional 1k$ to retake it each time. If you are in one accident where you are found at fault, your Autobahn license is restricted for 3 years. Your license naturally expires in 6 years, upon which date you are required to pay 500$ and retake the exam. Men from the ages of 19 to 70 are allowed to apply, but those under 25 must take an additional 1 week course for an additional 500$. Women from the ages of 25 to 50 are allowed to apply, but must take an additional 2 week course at an extra fee of 1k$ so they can learn how to park properly.

Every 6 months, your vehicle will be inspected to make sure it's safe up to the maximum speed rating for the road. Inspections cost 100$ and if you fail you must repay the fee each time. Vehicles must weigh no more than 5000lbs. There will be no emissions standards.

The minimum speed for the right most lane will be 55mph, and the middle and outer left lanes shall have minimums of 75mph. If you go under these limits for more than 20 minutes, your car will automatically self destruct.

That should work reasonably well, I'd imagine :)

[callen]

Wow.......glad you got this off your chest? Do of course agree with alot of this......we're bunch of lazy inconsiderate fat slobs that are okay to just think about our own world as we cruise down the freeway in our ridiculously large vehicles....okay now I feel better as well..

Grew up in Germany and just loved driving and riding on the autobahn

oh and the left lane has no minimum speed....stay out of it unless your passing and don't have flashing lights comming up from behind.

Callen 91 535i 5spd.

[Jason]

I drive in NY too and it would be scary to think of the disasters these people could cause on a highspeed road, and we aren't even considering the motorcyclists. Oh, and Alan, while you're at it, you forgot to mention the people that think its their God given right to drive in the left lane and those who interpret flashing headlights as grave offense. I am all for an american autobahn, and i would gladly surrender my license and start over. There needs to be strict rules. I've heard that in Germany it takes months and $$ to get a license and you have to have logged time in all types of conditions... I've had the pleasure of driving there, its like night and day.




It'll never happen, and for a lot of good reasons other than "speed is dangerous". The driving instruction and testing in this country is simply not up to task. Any idiot can take a 5 minute "test", and bam, there's your license sir/madam. On the roads of NY, I see people doing the damnest, most idiotic things, putting other motorists and pedestrians at risk. Just today I witnessed:

-People parking their SUVs on the side of a ___one lane road___ to pick their kids up from private school.

-People pulling over on a 2 lane road, and opening their door into traffic from behind, without a single concern.

-Tailgating trucks (I can't stand this)

-Travelling 15mph under the posted limit for no apparent reason

-Blatent disregard for stopsigns, traffic lights, right of way, and use of blinkers

I witnessed this all in about 1hr of tooling around town in the morning and during lunch. On a recent road trip to Virginia for a friend's funeral, I could've filled up a small encyclopedia with the crap I witnessed.

If it was going to happen, just for argument's sake, I would like to see this:

For an autobahn type road to exist, you would need toll booth devices at each end of said stretches of road, to read some type of EZPass device, which denotates authorization to drive at such speeds. In order to get one, you would need to pass a 2 week (80hrs) driving course, covering high speed driving, defensive, poor weather, etc. conditions. This course would cost 5k$ for entry, and if you fail the end exam, you have to pay an additional 1k$ to retake it each time. If you are in one accident where you are found at fault, your Autobahn license is restricted for 3 years. Your license naturally expires in 6 years, upon which date you are required to pay 500$ and retake the exam. Men from the ages of 19 to 70 are allowed to apply, but those under 25 must take an additional 1 week course for an additional 500$. Women from the ages of 25 to 50 are allowed to apply, but must take an additional 2 week course at an extra fee of 1k$ so they can learn how to park properly.

Every 6 months, your vehicle will be inspected to make sure it's safe up to the maximum speed rating for the road. Inspections cost 100$ and if you fail you must repay the fee each time. Vehicles must weigh no more than 5000lbs. There will be no emissions standards.

The minimum speed for the right most lane will be 55mph, and the middle and outer left lanes shall have minimums of 75mph. If you go under these limits for more than 20 minutes, your car will automatically self destruct.

That should work reasonably well, I'd imagine :)

[AllanS]

"stay out of it unless your passing and don't have flashing lights comming up from behind."

Sounds like what happened with that test driver for Mercedes a couple months back- Mother/Daughter were in left lane driving slowly, Mercedes test driver (name eludes me) came up on them, and the mother somehow freaked and swirved off the road. AFAIK, the Mercedes guy didn't do anything to really intimidate them other than driving fast.

I guess even with excellent testing/motorist restrictions, people do stupid ****. I don't know what the point of that was but, uhm... yep.

[ryan roopnarine]

there was some talk of the gentleman having passed the kia on the shoulder, and that being part of the reason the woman freaked out


"stay out of it unless your passing and don't have flashing lights comming up from behind."

Sounds like what happened with that test driver for Mercedes a couple months back- Mother/Daughter were in left lane driving slowly, Mercedes test driver (name eludes me) came up on them, and the mother somehow freaked and swirved off the road. AFAIK, the Mercedes guy didn't do anything to really intimidate them other than driving fast.

I guess even with excellent testing/motorist restrictions, people do stupid ****. I don't know what the point of that was but, uhm... yep.

[AllanS]

Yeah, I forgot the Uptight Citizen's Highway Brigade that likes to play cop on the highways. And trucks that play block-the-little-cars. And people driving into your lane without a blinker, and then flip you off when you honk at them for almost killing you. And the guys who "merge" at 40mph on a 65mph road, forced others to change lanes. And the ones who............................................etc .

Personally, I'm not a very good driver, but like alcoholism, or hairloss, the most important step is realization.

[Unregistered]

Like Calen, I grew up (formative years, anyhow) in Germany and love their cars and the autobahn. The autobahn was the inspiration for our interstate highway system, but is statistically about 20% safer than our interstates. This despite the fact that the autobahn has no speed limits in some areas, and significantly higher limits virtually everywhere else. Enforcement of driving on the right unless passing, etc., is a key to successful flow management and prevention of driver frustration and ultimately, road rage.

Here in Washington State, the cops are cracking down on "aggressive" drivers. It seems to me that they should even moreso crack down on passive-aggressive drivers,. i.e., those who seem to delight in hogging the left lane and/or failing to grant simple courtesy to those behind them and let them pass. These days, most people are in a hurry, with busy schedules, and it seems rude to delay them unnecessarily.

Years ago in Texas there was a "drive friendly" media campaign, with public service announcements on TV suggesting that slower drivers be courteous. That was the rule in rural Texas, and friendly ranchers and farmers in pickup trucks would just slip over onto the shoulder and let you pass. In response, we'd give a friendly wave, which was happily returned. So, the slower drivers could go slower, and let the faster drivers be on their way, and both appreciated the common, neighborly courtesy. This in sharp contrast to today's road-rage and incidents where passive-agressive blocking probably causes other drivers to take risks they otherwise would not.

Traffic flow and common courtesy would both benefit if we had a national "drive friendly" campaign like that of Texas ~30 years ago. I'll bet traffic safety would improve markedly, too.

Perhaps we could initiate a letter writing campaign to legislators and highway patrol departments to this effect, or at least ask them to crack down on "passive-agressive" drivers while they're out there.

[BennyM]

1. Some of those fees are outrageous. Less-wealthy people can still drive well.

2. Since when do people park on the autobahn?

[RobPatt 93 525i]

saying somthing like "if there's 5 cars behind you, in the left lane, move over"... Great idea, glad to see it, but 5 cars is excessive! On the right track though...



Like Calen, I grew up (formative years, anyhow) in Germany and love their cars and the autobahn. The autobahn was the inspiration for our interstate highway system, but is statistically about 20% safer than our interstates. This despite the fact that the autobahn has no speed limits in some areas, and significantly higher limits virtually everywhere else. Enforcement of driving on the right unless passing, etc., is a key to successful flow management and prevention of driver frustration and ultimately, road rage.

Here in Washington State, the cops are cracking down on "aggressive" drivers. It seems to me that they should even moreso crack down on passive-aggressive drivers,. i.e., those who seem to delight in hogging the left lane and/or failing to grant simple courtesy to those behind them and let them pass. These days, most people are in a hurry, with busy schedules, and it seems rude to delay them unnecessarily.

Years ago in Texas there was a "drive friendly" media campaign, with public service announcements on TV suggesting that slower drivers be courteous. That was the rule in rural Texas, and friendly ranchers and farmers in pickup trucks would just slip over onto the shoulder and let you pass. In response, we'd give a friendly wave, which was happily returned. So, the slower drivers could go slower, and let the faster drivers be on their way, and both appreciated the common, neighborly courtesy. This in sharp contrast to today's road-rage and incidents where passive-agressive blocking probably causes other drivers to take risks they otherwise would not.

Traffic flow and common courtesy would both benefit if we had a national "drive friendly" campaign like that of Texas ~30 years ago. I'll bet traffic safety would improve markedly, too.

Perhaps we could initiate a letter writing campaign to legislators and highway patrol departments to this effect, or at least ask them to crack down on "passive-agressive" drivers while they're out there.

[shragon]

link doesn't work, exceeded bandwidth.

however, an autobahn in the US would be dangerous. most of the drivers on the road really suck at driving. the process and tests of obtaining a license in the US are too easy and drivers training is not good enough. this all results in the amount of poor drivers we see on the road today.

[callen]

well I now live in Texas....drove downtown Houston this morning following one or our finest on highway...made 30 or so lane changes never touched his blinker......

why can't people be anal like us when it comes to rules and procedures....LOL

during last trip to Germany autobahns were much more congested and alot of it is speed regulated.............

always remember listening to Van Halen in the back of old 5 series belonging to my older brother burning down the Autoban 220km's .......David Lee Roth "no no no don't take them of..."

[Porschmn]

Where there a line of tow trucks behind? I have seen that also. One car with no lights on and changing lanes at warp speed. He was being followed by two tow trucks doing the same. All doing well over posted speed. 610 at 59. Boy was that fun to watch.

[rickm]

My favorite is when folks slam on their brakes when they see a police car on the other side of the road, seperated by 2 sets of guardrails, writing someone a ticket. It's like..."dumbass, he's not going to call in reinforcements because you're doing 6 over".

I did drive up behind a Kia with 4 people in it today. Left lane, the driver was looking to the right at the passenger next to him chatting away like he was at home. I need an airhorn...pull up, BEEEEEEEEEEEEPPPPPPPPP. That'll soil a few pairs of shorts. :)

[jplacson]

If I remember right, the Autobahn doesn't allow cars that can't hit at least 75mph... I don't know if this is the minimum for it or not though.

Another thing is that driving in America (in general) is fairly boring. A/Ts are the standard since the majority is too lazy to figure out how a stick works. Most are too eager to get their license, and not taught well enough.

I think there's too much emphasis on how to 'switch lanes' the right way (duh, if you can't figure that one out on your own... you shouldn't be allowed in a 2 ton killing machine)

More emphasis should be on emergency situations... braking, skid control, etc... everyone expects the car to drive for them... uhm... hire a driver. If the DSC on your car is smarter than you... let someone else with more than half a brain drive.

Regulations for being allowed driving in the US should be stricter. I feel for you guys cuz in the Phil, you seriously don't even need a license to drive... God knows most of our public utility vehicles are driven by people who think the middle lane on the highway is a parking space. And they actually want to start imposing a speed limit here, when we have way too much traffic already... I say, the faster you get off the road, the less traffic it's gonna be for the rest of the commuting public!!! hehehehe!!!

DOWN WITH SPEED LIMITS!!!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

[mmaddock]

The reason German drivers are better than most of the rest of the world is that they have to take a mandatory 40 hours under instruction and under all different conditions - day/night - dry/rain (anyone who had driven through Germany can testify to the rain!!) before they are allowed out on the roads on their own.

Nothing to do with speed limits - it's all about tuition.

The UK Govt keep trying to persuade us that "Speed Kills" Bollocks does it, dumb-ass drivers kill. Every study they present us with is twisted (or simply ignored) One they did a few years ago found that only 6% of accidents are caused by excessive speed - that study barely got a mention - what a surprise!

A very recent govt study showed that speeding was the 7th most likely cause of an accident. 7th!!! Why aren't they concentrating on the 6 above speeding? It gets worse - speeding was actually classified as 'Excessive Speed' - a term used by the Police. However in 70% of accidents where 'Excessive Speed' is cited as the cause, that speed is actually WITHIN the speed limit of the road.

As a statistician, I get rather p'd off when figures are 'fondled' to show what someone wants, and not the truth.

If the govt want to make driving safer, stop spending £millions on speed cameras (and getting back £millions in fines!) and spend it on teaching people how to drive!!

...breath...ahhh, better :-) Rant over !

Still, I managed to reguarly drive at 130mph between Manchester and London in my younger days :-) How can you guys stand it at 55/65 - I'd be asleep in 15 mins! I truly think I am a safer driver at 90mph than 70mph because my concentration is far more focused on the road.

[AllanS]

You gotta pay to play; excessive fees will keep people out unless they really want to get in, and make taking the test something not to be... taken lightly (sorry for the pun).

And parking would really only be for emergencies, or for fuel; a safe place to pull over when your water pump's plastic impeller blows up.

[AllanS]

I think that the speed limits are just easy revenue generators; if the politicians can spin it that speed is dangerous, it just eases public ire at said limits, and the cameras all over the place.

Allan's armchair guide on how to reduce the need for revenue generators like this:

Make roads last longer by keeping trucks off them, and using proper contruction instead of constantly patching old shitty ones.

Get rid of idiotic speed limits and cameras, and you lose the need for expensive police force personnel.

Increase road capacity and decrease amount of funds spent on public transportation outside of major cities

[AllanS]

Ohhhhh... that's a bit different. I didn't know that. I thought he just came up quickly behind her.

[Dick Schneiders]

that Nevada didn't have a speed limit on their interstates back a few years ago. I don't remember when that changed, but when I got out of the US Air Force in 1970, I had a 1970 Datsun 2000 roadster that I had purchased in Okinawa and shipped to San Francisco where I was discharged. As I drove back home to Kansas, I really enjoyed being able to drive this quick little sports car at speeds over 40 mph, which was the limit in Okinawa. When I hit Nevada and discovered that they had no maximum speed limit, I cruised at 120 across the state, with the top down (my hair was short in those days :-) ). I was actually passed a few times by drivers in their big German sedans, and a couple of them made me feel like I was still driving at 40!

I don't know when or why that changed, but it was certainly fun and I would equate this with the Autobahn.

Dick Schneiders

[AllanS]

Weren't they forced to put a limit on that finally, due to US Gov strongarming, ie. refusing highway funds? I think the states are too dependant on government funding, but there's no other way I guess.

[Unregistered]

.. our roads were not designed by civil engineers for those speeds and secondly most people are just too stupid and ignorant of the rules and safety requirements to be able to drive at those speeds. How would you like to come across someone wjile going 120 mph who suddenly darts out into your lane without a signal or even looking. The unfortunate 'me first' attitude in this country does more harm than good.



Weren't they forced to put a limit on that finally, due to US Gov strongarming, ie. refusing highway funds? I think the states are too dependant on government funding, but there's no other way I guess.

[TheGeak]

Dick: Allan is right about Nevada imposing a Speed Limit so they could retain national funding. Montana just tried to remove their speed limit a few years ago, but wound up having to put it back so that they could contine to recieve that o' so needed government money. Same reason its 21+ to consume alcohol in all 50 states....if it was <21 they wouldn't get any money from government.

Secondly, our highways just couldn't handle an 'autobahn' style driving. Have you ever looked into the constuction of the autobahn? The road is something like a minimum of almost a meter thick everywhere. Its also designed to take advantage of the natural terrain as opposed to the american "oh there's a hill, lets dig it up and put a highway through it" mentality. I'm all for being able to drive at whatever speed is comfortable for people, but you definately need to be trained.

At almost $5000 and 40 hours of 'actual road driving' plus classroom instruction its no wonder those germans can get away with doing 150+ mph and still be safer than our 55mph "interstates"

Interesting fact most of you probably know but i just thought of again....its federal law that 1 mile in every 5 of an interstate must be straight and wide enough to be used as a makeshift runway in case of a war.

Jason

[Dick Schneiders]

I knew that was probably the reason why they had to impose a speed limit. That was the same way that the 55 mph limits were forced on states, even for interstates, for awhile. I was doing a lot of highway travelling for my job back then and hated it. I love driving, but 55 on an Interstate would put me to sleep. I feel that I am a safe driver, but I actually read books while driving in those days. I devised a way to prop the book up in the middle of the steering wheel and on those long, lonely stretches of Kansas Interstate I would read whenever there wasn't much traffic. It was the only way I could stay awake.




Dick: Allan is right about Nevada imposing a Speed Limit so they could retain national funding. Montana just tried to remove their speed limit a few years ago, but wound up having to put it back so that they could contine to recieve that o' so needed government money. Same reason its 21+ to consume alcohol in all 50 states....if it was <21 they wouldn't get any money from government.

Secondly, our highways just couldn't handle an 'autobahn' style driving. Have you ever looked into the constuction of the autobahn? The road is something like a minimum of almost a meter thick everywhere. Its also designed to take advantage of the natural terrain as opposed to the american "oh there's a hill, lets dig it up and put a highway through it" mentality. I'm all for being able to drive at whatever speed is comfortable for people, but you definately need to be trained.

At almost $5000 and 40 hours of 'actual road driving' plus classroom instruction its no wonder those germans can get away with doing 150+ mph and still be safer than our 55mph "interstates"

Interesting fact most of you probably know but i just thought of again....its federal law that 1 mile in every 5 of an interstate must be straight and wide enough to be used as a makeshift runway in case of a war.

Jason

[Unregistered]

The interstate highway system was modelled directly on the German autobahns, per the Defense Highway Act of 1956. Pres. Eisenhower, as Gen. Eisenhower, had invaded Germany and in the process he and other American leaders came to greatly admire the autobahn system. Being initially funded as a part of the defense budget, emergency runways were baked into the cake, again, just as the Germans had used the autobahns in WWII. The interstate highways have lots of steel-reinforced slabs that are 6' thick in places, to take the stresses of takeoffs and landings by our heavy bombers, and to be nuke-proof. When I flew for Strategic Air Command, we had info on where we could land in a war, including on many stretches of interstate.

That said, much of the system is inferior to the autobahn, in terms of thickness and quality of the road, and in terms of basic design. Further, our drivers and vehicles are mostly inferior, and we have a cultural difference in outlook and attitude. I wish we had fully emulated the autobahn system and made it all under central control, rather than state and local jurisdiction. But, we neglected to do that 50 years ago, and are (sadly) stuck with the present system. I don't see that ever changing, for political, economic, and social reasons here in the US. I wish it would, but it won't.

[TheGeak]

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[callen]

no but that is sooo typical......mayor is trying to fix this...though. Hardy going south....is a great commuter street though....traffics always going 80mph...at least. Try it if you haven't already....and if you see a grey five series in your rearview mirror with left signal on get the hell out of the way.....LOL of course.

[Unregistered]

Thank you for the compliment.

I neglected to add that our present system is (as we all ruefully know) a major revenue source for local jurisdictions, who use cops to collect bigtime and trumped-up traffic tickets. Yet another reason the present system will never improve. The cops have a quota, whether the admit it or not, and the funds go to into greedy local gov't. coffers. Can you say "Boss Hogg"?

[Porschmn]

I would like to think the old 540/6 could hang with the 80+mph!!