Behr sucks big time- just venting

[EricV]

Hi all. I have a '93 525i 5-spd, M50 VANOS, 114K on it, very well maintained and, in my opinion, it's a POS. :)

Kind of joking on the last part. In all fairness I've had the car 7 years and 45 thousand miles and overall it really has been pretty good to me. Well, a few months ago the trans gave up the ghost at 113K (yeah, I guess we all learn in hindsight that the Getrag is disposable sh*t :) and today I learn that I am putting the FIFTH radiator (previous owner did two, and this is my third.) To say I am pissed at Behr doesn't even begin to capture it, but then again this puts my two month bill on this car at around 2,500, so I'm a little biased as that exceeds it's value. Still, DISPOSABLE PLASTIC RADIATORS were a stupid idea to begin with, and the think tank that is BMW should have realized this.

Car looks like new, it's been immaculately maintained, blah. blah, blah but still my '93 Civic w/ 165 K (original clutch, trans, and radiator mind you) blows it away- reliability wise (well, and tightness wise.)

I still love the e34- it's an absolutely beautiful machine. It's just disappojnting that a car that's been so well cared for is falling apart at 114K.

I appreciate the opportunity to vent- that's all I really wanted to do. :) Just releasing some frustration as I realize my two month bill could have gone a long way towards another (real) car. My real frustration is directed at Behr for making a total POS unit.

Best to all of you though- this forum has always been a great source of information and I appreciate it a great, great deal.

Eric

[Russell]

Yep cooling systems on the e34 are junk. Try a different brand of radiator. Nissens is what I just installed in my car per the recommendation of my mechanic. He said that Behr radiators just do not hold up as well.

[bubba966]

Why not put an all aluminum radiator in it instead of dropping more plastic rads in it? You've got a few different choices as far as I'm aware for the M50. VAC, IE, Zionsville, and a few others I think.

What's been crapping out on the rads?

[EricV]

I went ahead and went w/ the Behr this morning, and should have researched this I'll grant.

The last couple of times they let me supply the part, so it was pretty cheap. I'd bought the Behr for like 160 and felt lucky. This one is costing me 370. I figured I pretty much had to cave as this shop is THE best (I drive an hour to get there) and they've let me supply parts in the past (radiators, suspension upgrade, even the transmission)- they're allowed me to save a bundle. Well, the last visit before this was the transmission, and while they let me supply the trans he politely said they can't keep letting me supply parts so I didn't push it on this one (though I did throw it out that I could get it a he*l of a lot cheaper...he didn't bite :) ) Oh well...wish it was easier to find a great trustworthy mechanic that allows customer supplied parts.

I won't kick my a*s over getting another Behr. Apparently they're good for about 23K miles (geez, sounds stupid but I have the records to prove it) and in another 23K this car will either a.) be long gone, sold to some poor sod or b.) simply have decomposed in spite of routine and above average maintenance. Now if I do miraculously begin to feel the love again (don't see that happening, it's like finding out your lovely wife is a f'ing psychopath...you never really see her the same) then maybe I'll keep on rolling (I only put about 1,000 to 1,500 K on per year, so this Behr should last about another 15 years at that rate...and I KNOW the bleedin' car will have decomposed by that time!)

[EricV]

Sorry about that. 2 things: the Great Repeater is the expansion tank itself...seems prone to cracking. The other issue is the upper neck- those break off spectacularly. There's also the join where the expansion tank mates to the radiator...some say that o-ring can be replaced, but I've never bothered to try (as back then the shop was letting me supply the radiator, and they're cheap if you buy them direct.)

Again, I don't mean to rag on BMW/e-34's (I wouldn't have kept it seven years of I didn't feel some love) but man I've had numerous other cars way past 114K w/ no issues to speak of (the old Honda previously mentioned, and three Audi Quattros w/out fail that went far above this mileage.) I used to not fear cars over 100K, but I sure do now.

[Tiger]

When you get your car back... let it cool down or slowly release the radiator cap... loosen up the upper radiator clamp until it it free... then tighten it down until it contact the hose and snug that you can still turn it... then snug it down 2 full turn or if it get real tight... then stop.

Basically you want the hose to be tight but not squeezing the upper radiator neck so tight that will crack it. Get it? I think the biggest reason is people clamped down the radiator neck too tight and upon numerous expansion and contraction... the neck breaks.

Do the bottom neck also. Then start up the car and let it runs... build pressure and check for leak.

[nirvana19]

hmm well-maintained 93 525i 5-speed low mileage. Yeah you're right that cars about to die, better get rid of it quick. Hell, since I'm a generous guy I"ll take it off your hands for you :p

Just kidding of course, sorry to hear that you've been having a bad time with the car. I wouldn't call the future owner a sob.. if the car really is well-maintained and the cooling system is the only recurring problem (transmission is unfortunate, but if that was properly fixed as it sounds like it was it shouldn't be a problem for quite some time) it would actually be a great car for someone not depending on a mechanic to do all the work (not to say theres anything wrong with that, but I can imagine it would be quite painful paying the same labor rates charged for fixing cars worth 20x your E34). If you had to deal with all the issues I do with my car you (as most sane people) would probably have shot yourself in the foot by now.

G'luck and hopefully your car will treat you well for as long as you continue to have it!

[Jehu]

45,000 miles in 7 years huh? You're gonna drive that thing into the ground aren't you?

I put as many miles again (130,000) on this car in the past two and half years that it drove in its first 11... my (Behr) rad is Rad! Sorry to hear about the grief...

[Dave M]

MAybe the Behr isn't a sgood as the Nissens on M50s due to the integrated expansion tank. My Nissens has been solid for the last 5 years. As for the tranny, the manual Getrag puked after only 114k? Interesting...... What went? Not that it matters, but my ZF 310 has 300+k without a sign of trouble.

Curious,

Dave

[attack eagle]

meh I jsut put another behr in mine.

193K and I can not seem to find any reciept for one before, though It might be the 3rd as the neck was repaired. I seriously doubt it though.


I hurt the previous one when removing the atf cooler lines.

that being said, no way in hell would I buy a zionsville for an m50... Near 1000 because you have to buy the fan, shroud and all that other jazz as a kit instead of just a rad.

[EricV]

I really appreciate the feedback and advice! I also appreciate you letting me vent. I'm over the initial irritation, for the most part, just getting paranoid about the thing. Here we go:

Tiger- good advice...I'll do that. I'll also talk to the mechanic when I pick it up just to feel him out on how he does it. It's definitely worth doing what you've suggested.

Nirvana- you make good points for sure. It's the logic that's kept this going, and a large part of me still says that it may indeed be a good car. I've had numerous other things go, but those were pretty minor in comparison. I'll be hanging onto your contact info for when I'm truly over it...it is chipped, has the eibach set up w/ m5 sways and a few other modest improvements! :)

Jehu- yeah, I'll be the first to admit my mileage is laughable. :) I've lived only a few miles from work for years (more like 1.5 miles one way) and just moved to a place two blocks from work. I primarily use it to jackass about town but walk to work. I'm lucky that way, and you won't hear me bellyache about what I pay for gas! I envy your car...if I had it to do over again I'd hold out for one of those for sure...enjoy and be safe.

Dave- it threw the 2nd gear synchro, and that was all she wrote. In all my years of driving I've never had a transmission go south. From what I learned the Getrag of this era/make is pretty well known for this issue, in most cases around the mileage I experienced it. The ZF's are indeed more robust...wish I had one. Oh well, to my way of thinking (and the mileage I drive) this one will be the last anyway. As for Behr/Nissen...I should have paused to re-research the issue and go w/ something other than Behr.

I should say that my day ended w/ me telling a co-worker, who said "What? That thing is 15 years old? I've always thought that was a beautiful car..." :)

Thanks again all. It's always a pleasure to commiserate w/ a crowd that understands what's sometimes a love/hate relationship....folks who know the car. I also, as always, appreciate the wealth of info and feedback here.

Eric

[Jehu]

I really appreciate the feedback and advice! I also appreciate you letting me vent. I'm over the initial irritation, for the most part, just getting paranoid about the thing. Here we go:

Tiger- good advice...I'll do that. I'll also talk to the mechanic when I pick it up just to feel him out on how he does it. It's definitely worth doing what you've suggested.

Nirvana- you make good points for sure. It's the logic that's kept this going, and a large part of me still says that it may indeed be a good car. I've had numerous other things go, but those were pretty minor in comparison. I'll be hanging onto your contact info for when I'm truly over it...it is chipped, has the eibach set up w/ m5 sways and a few other modest improvements! :)

Jehu- yeah, I'll be the first to admit my mileage is laughable. :) I've lived only a few miles from work for years (more like 1.5 miles one way) and just moved to a place two blocks from work. I primarily use it to jackass about town but walk to work. I'm lucky that way, and you won't hear me bellyache about what I pay for gas! I envy your car...if I had it to do over again I'd hold out for one of those for sure...enjoy and be safe.

Dave- it threw the 2nd gear synchro, and that was all she wrote. In all my years of driving I've never had a transmission go south. From what I learned the Getrag of this era/make is pretty well known for this issue, in most cases around the mileage I experienced it. The ZF's are indeed more robust...wish I had one. Oh well, to my way of thinking (and the mileage I drive) this one will be the last anyway. As for Behr/Nissen...I should have paused to re-research the issue and go w/ something other than Behr.

I should say that my day ended w/ me telling a co-worker, who said "What? That thing is 15 years old? I've always thought that was a beautiful car..." :)

Thanks again all. It's always a pleasure to commiserate w/ a crowd that understands what's sometimes a love/hate relationship....folks who know the car. I also, as always, appreciate the wealth of info and feedback here.

Eric


maybe the fact I drive it so much factors in certain aspects lasting longer than in a car that is parked somuch of its life... the lubricating and cleansing of operation may prevent corrosion from taking place in some areas.... but its alwasy nice to hear compliments on one's ride...

[bubba966]

that being said, no way in hell would I buy a zionsville for an m50... Near 1000 because you have to buy the fan, shroud and all that other jazz as a kit instead of just a rad.

Just get the one that they market to the E36 guys that is just the aluminum rad. Not sure why they don't list that option for the E34. There's no difference in the E34 & E36 M50 rads, right?

[Dave M]

Just get the one that they market to the E36 guys that is just the aluminum rad. Not sure why they don't list that option for the E34. There's no difference in the E34 & E36 M50 rads, right?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe the e36 rad has an integrated expansion tank.

Dave

[bubba966]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe the e36 rad has an integrated expansion tank.

Dave

Guess next time I'll have to actually look at things before I say anything.

Yes, you're right. The E36 M50 rad doesn't have the integrated expansion tank like the E34 M50 does. Thought it did as pretty much everything else interchanges that I was aware of. Guess if I actually owned an M50 powered vehicle (I just work on one every now and again) I'd know better.