ATF fluid change, the easy Korean way

[shogun]

good idea by uropal from South Korea, using a shampoo bottle pump for that
http://www.bimmerboard.com/forums/posts/615855

He measures exactly the volume pumped out and refills the same amount.
Of course, ATF filter is not changed then, but a good idea for a in-between-change.

[ryan roopnarine]

i've posted about using that method here several times over the past 4 years. i use a gear oil pump that (aside looking bigger than his) gets about 1 ounce a pump out. he's got his procedure wrong, though. as best as i can tell from his broken english, he warms the car up first. you have to do it when the car is stone cold, otherwise the fluid level will be wrong once the new fluid heats up. it's good for removing overfilled motor oil, evacuating brake resivoirs with a clean piece of hose, PS fluid, et cetera.

[shogun]

the fluid level cannot be wrong, as he just refills what he pumps out in this procedure. You can see the measuring jar there. This procedure is of course not right if you want to measure the correct liquid level in the ATF, but it is just to show an easy ATF fluid change. Not too bad in my opinion, can be done by anybody without a pit and very easy.

I might do it as interim partial fluid change next time, much easier than from the bottom.

[Ross]

Necessity being the mother of invention and all I guess this will work. Lots of pumping with that little thing,I'll bet his wrist is sorer than a 14 year old with Dad's Playboy magagzines.

[Bill R.]

here is much easier , has a 8'8 liter capacity also. You can pump fluid with it as well as draw fluid out.... They have a handle like a bicycle pump, you give it about 20 strokes and then just for it to finish sucking the fluid out.
The side of the reservoir is marked so you know how much you've taken out. Mityvac makes a number of differnet ones, one thats powered by shop air if you don't want to hand pump. A cheaper one that only evacuates doesn't allow you to pump fluid in.
The only hassle is cleaning them, so if your going to use one to pump fluid in ,its better to have 2 one for sucking it out and one for putting it in. They also have brake bleeder adapter kits for it, to bleed your brakes with.http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/MIT-MV7201.html

[ryan roopnarine]

here is much easier , has a 8'8 liter capacity also. You can pump fluid with it as well as draw fluid out.... They have a handle like a bicycle pump, you give it about 20 strokes and then just for it to finish sucking the fluid out.
The side of the reservoir is marked so you know how much you've taken out. Mityvac makes a number of differnet ones, one thats powered by shop air if you don't want to hand pump. A cheaper one that only evacuates doesn't allow you to pump fluid in.
The only hassle is cleaning them, so if your going to use one to pump fluid in ,its better to have 2 one for sucking it out and one for putting it in. They also have brake bleeder adapter kits for it, to bleed your brakes with.http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/MIT-MV7201.html

I saw someone using one of those on bobistheoilguy.com for the same purpose. I'm too cheap to buy one for this purpose, however, because all of the cars that i've ever put the hose down the dipstick on have about 3-4 quarts in the bottom, and you don't have to clean out oil motor oil bottles when you're done measuring out the evacuated amount. i have 3 lengths of hose in my toolbox to hook up to my hand pump, nasty (evacuating everything oil based), semiformal (new oil) and formal (brake fluid). that cost me about a dollar for the three, i'm too cheap to buy 2 mityvacs :D

[ryan roopnarine]

the fluid level cannot be wrong, as he just refills what he pumps out in this procedure. You can see the measuring jar there. This procedure is of course not right if you want to measure the correct liquid level in the ATF, but it is just to show an easy ATF fluid change. Not too bad in my opinion, can be done by anybody without a pit and very easy.

I might do it as interim partial fluid change next time, much easier than from the bottom.

i'm going to have to disagree with your admonition that the fluid level cannot be wrong. he clearly states that he drives the car and gets it warm before he does this. he is replacing operating temperature transmission fluid with cold fluid out of a bottle. unless he's heating the fluid in the bottle up, he can't get a proportional replacement. i find that 1/2 quart of cold fluid equals about 5/8-3/4 quart hot fluid in most of the cars i play with. the idea that one can change the fluid with a hand pump is not wrong, but the idea that hot=cold level is.

[JD525IA]

good idea by uropal from South Korea, using a shampoo bottle pump for that
http://www.bimmerboard.com/forums/posts/615855

He measures exactly the volume pumped out and refills the same amount.
Of course, ATF filter is not changed then, but a good idea for a in-between-change.



I just rigged a glass chemistry vapor bottle with some rubber hose and attached my vacuum cleaner to it. The fluid was drawn out via vacuum and went into the bottle and not the vaccum because the tube attachment was about 1/2 inch below the opening of the bottle. I admit that I did warm it up before doing this so that it would flow faster.

Wouldn't it make sense to measure the volume after it cools and then put back in the same amount, at the same cool temperature? You could also get some idea of the change in volume in the fluid at the hi/low temperatures.

Does tranny fluid really change in volume at different temps?

Any hoo, the whole contraption looked like some college kids hooka or bong. Matter of fact, I've got an idea!

JD

[Bill R.]

on sale. One of my friends has one at his shop and its lasted a couple of years, he's pretty bad about abusing stuff too. Uses it 3 to 4 times a week on various things.




I saw someone using one of those on bobistheoilguy.com for the same purpose. I'm too cheap to buy one for this purpose, however, because all of the cars that i've ever put the hose down the dipstick on have about 3-4 quarts in the bottom, and you don't have to clean out oil motor oil bottles when you're done measuring out the evacuated amount. i have 3 lengths of hose in my toolbox to hook up to my hand pump, nasty (evacuating everything oil based), semiformal (new oil) and formal (brake fluid). that cost me about a dollar for the three, i'm too cheap to buy 2 mityvacs :D

[russiankid]

Its not that hard to loosen drain plug.

[Ross]

I just rigged a glass chemistry vapor bottle with some rubber hose and attached my vacuum cleaner to it. The fluid was drawn out via vacuum and went into the bottle and not the vaccum because the tube attachment was about 1/2 inch below the opening of the bottle. I admit that I did warm it up before doing this so that it would flow faster.

Wouldn't it make sense to measure the volume after it cools and then put back in the same amount, at the same cool temperature? You could also get some idea of the change in volume in the fluid at the hi/low temperatures.

Does tranny fluid really change in volume at different temps?

Any hoo, the whole contraption looked like some college kids hooka or bong. Matter of fact, I've got an idea!

JD
I'd pay to have seen that.

[shogun]

Does tranny fluid really change in volume at different temps?

Of course!

Thermal Expansion


The volume of a given oil mass increases with temperature, therefore, its density decreases. The degree of expansion is expressed as the coefficient of thermal expansion. Thermal expansion is useful to determine the size of a container needed when the oil will be heated. Inexperienced people often have an oil overflow because of a surprising amount of thermal expansion.


In hydrodynamic lubrication, the thermal expansion of the oil in the clearance of a bearing increases the hydraulic pressure. Some researchers discuss the "thermal wedge" mechanism of film formation and apply it to parallel sliding surfaces, especially flat, non tilting, thrust bearings.

The coefficient of thermal expansion is the ratio of the relative change of volume to a change in temperature. Thermal expansion is expressed as the ratio of volume change to the initial volume after heating 1 degree C. Therefore, the unit is reciprocal degree C, or degree C-1. The values of the coefficient of thermal expansion for mineral oil are near 6.4 X 10-4 °C-1.

Thermal expansion (or contraction) determinations require the measurement of the volume of a given mass of oil at various temperatures. The sample is placed in a graduated cylinder and the volume is observed as the temperature is either increased or decreased. A simplified method of calculating the thermal expansion of petroleum products can be found in ASTM D 1250, Petroleum Measurement Tables, "Volume Corrections Factors".

http://www.pantherlubes.com/tl_6.html

[Blitzkrieg Bob]

Lot of work for nothing.

No filter change.

The ZF trans has drain plugs and dip stick.