OT: Mobiles and routers

[whiskychaser]

Firstly, can I say I dont understand why you would want to connect to the net with your mobile when you have a laptop that works fine. I use a PC and its hard wired via the router. It works fine, has got a great big screen I can see and I'm very happy thanks. BUT my partner and her son have an ipod and a Nokia 5800 and they wont connect to the net via the WRT54GS router.
(I have a crappy LG. It texts and sends pictures. WTF else do I need?)
Well if I bugger about with a static IP on the 5800 it will connect but thats a lot of good if you go somewhere else. So can anybody recommend a router which WILL work? I've searched and they all seem to have a problem with one or the other. Yeah I know I should post this on an IT forum but I prefer to talk to people who speak a language I understand

[Tiger]

I don't think it is the router hardware problem, but rather the configuration. Depends on where you live... and how many other routers in the vincinity. Say you live in city area that have multiple wireless routers, you need to do a couple of things.

1. Select a certain channel other than default so not all routers are using the same channel... even if it is auto... select it manually for one that seems easier to connect.

2. Since that is a b/g router... in the configurlation, select G only... that way it doesn't waste resources trying to decide whether b or g connection.

3. If there are multiple routers, say everyone has a 192.168.2.1... you need to choose other addresses so devices don't get confused on which router... so select like 192.168.45.1 for your router... and range of 192.168.45.60 to 192.168.45.100.

Once you do all of the above, be sure check that your wired pc is reset to that address by rebooting your pc or do ipconfig /release and ipconfig /renew command prompt.

Then try connecting your wireless devices.

[Tiger]

Also, if your router is like a couple of years old, be sure to update your firmware via wired connection.

[LunatiC]

Make sure that your Wifi authentication / encryption is set to be the same as what the phone supports.

Ie. if the phone supports WEP only, then your Wifi needs to dish out WEP authentication.

This isn't the only problem that could stop a stable connection on the phone, but it's a start I guess. There could be a dozen other things that could cause issues, I guess the one I mentioned above is just one to eliminate from the list.

BTW, I have mobile phones in my household that doesn't support WPA2 (what my wifi connection provides), I just have a policy in my house stating that if your phone doesn't support the security I provide, then you're stuck on 3G (or even 2G!). No way am I going to reduce my security level and risk being compromised just for your shitty phone ;) Naturally my iPhone has no problems connecting.

[whiskychaser]

Thanks for the responses Gents. And in a language I can understand:)
The router has latest firmware, is set to WEP and has DHCP enabled.
I tried setting to G only, using a different channel and changing the IP address but without any luck.
The router can see the ipod and gives it an IP address. The ipod can see the router but when you click to connect to it, it hangs and then puts in an odd 169 address. But if you take it back to the shop it connects and gets on the net in seconds
The Nokia also sees the router, gets an IP address but then comes up with 'no gateway'. If I give it a static IP and input the gateway and dns server details manually, it will connect. But thats no good if you use it somewhere else
I've read that the Nokia 5800 and ipod can both have problems with the WRT54GS but havent come across a good reason why. Its about 5 years old and I dont mind buying a new one if its saves the earache!
So Lunatic, mind me asking what router you are using? might just give it a try

[whiskychaser]

Just had an online chat with Cisco (who make Linksys products). Their only solution is to set static IPs for both the iPOD and Nokia 5800. I asked if they could suggest another product that would work. Best they came up with was the WRT610N where you can reserve an IP. Think maybe we will have to wander around the shops with both phones and find a network they will both log onto without messing about

[Tiger]

I copied this from a website. How come you are not using WPA? WEP really sux.

hey..hows ur nokia 5800..i guess everybody is wrong..i just got my new 5800 a while ago connected to my wireless router and i want it it to share with u.. the secret is ...the GATEWAY..u must know the ip address and subnet mask of ur desktop computer and gateway of ur router..do this tru ryt click on ur icon of ur wireless network connection on the lower ryt corner of ur screen..then click status..click support...did u see ur default gateway?



now go and set up the following on ur fone

menu
settings
connectivity
destination
internet
choose ur router's name (be sure that ur fone is disconected to ur router while on this set up)
options
edit
options
advance settings
IPv4 settings
phone ip address
switch from automatic to defined settings
for example ,the ip address of ur desktop computer is 192.168.1.102, make ur fone ip address to be 192.168.1.103
then copy the subnet mask and the default gateway of ur desktop computer.. ex. subnet mask = 255.255.255.0 default gateway = 192.168.1.1
done
You can now connect to ur wireless router...the moment ur already connected,u can now start surfing the net...



that's all folks...

[Tiger]

which ipod do you have?

[Tiger]

Another tip on Ipod

If you are using a third-party router, you should use the WPA key that is generated after you type in your passphrase on the router. If you type in "subscriptions" as your passphrase, a key will be generated that is usually 26 letters in length. It will be a combination of capital letters, lower case letters and numbers. It is a pain to type in correctly, especially since the Touch only gives you a brief second to see if you are typing the information in accurately.

Also, on your router, if you are using WPA you might want to change to TKIP; if you are using WPA2, you should use AES. If you do have a setting on your router that allows for both, then use that. Right now I am using AES with WPA2 from a Linksys N-Router and I can connect to my Touch.

Maybe you have this "on"
If you have MAC address filtering enabled on your router, don't forget that you must enter the MAC address that is on your Touch into the router in order to get access.

[whiskychaser]

which ipod do you have?
I used the procedure you quoted to get the Nokia 5800 Music to connect though it can be a little hit and miss. And if you want to use it somewhere else you have to mess about with the settings again.

Its an ipod touch. But I couldnt get it to work the same way as the Nokia, maybe because the software doesnt let you input 2 x DNS addresses.
I'm using a WEP generated key because one of the laptops wouldnt connect otherwise. But that got damaged in a 'flood' so I should really change it. I havent got MAC filtering on so that shouldnt be a problem.

I'm thinking of packing the two of them off to Burger King or motorway services or the airport with their phones. When they find something they can both connect to, they can find out what it is and can come home:D

Many thanks for the help!

[Tiger]

Mmm... yes I see the problem.

You really should be using WPA or WPA2 if you can. My suggestion is to set your router to WPA... turn off the WEP... you may had both on at th same time... Once it is set to WPA, unplug your router and let it reset.

Then try to link up to your phones and Ipod. I deal with network all the time and I never had problem getting something to connect. My uncle live in city and there are tons of hidden routers nearby him and he couldn't connect to his own router via laptop... I reset and change some settings and done... no problem anymore.

I live in suburb and still there are a couple of routers in my neighbor... I had occasional problem and resolved by changing some settings in router.

That is why I don't believe it is hard to connect... it is usually because of the lack of knowledge.

Reset the Ipod and Nokia to auto config.

[Ferret]

The apple ipod touch/iphone devices I've found are extremely sensitive to certain types of hardware - we've got an old belkin router and I dont know what the hell it's playing at but if you connect the iphone to the belkin router - the router hard crashes and has to be unplugged.

Annoyingly the later g version of the router which we now have works perfectly with my iphone...

If you scan around the net the apple devices seem to have some interesting incompatibility issues with certain router hardware. I keep mine connected so it can auto update apps so much quicker than using 3g etc!

If it wont pick up the address automatically, and you've confirmed the key properly, just google that model and ipod incompatibility or iphone incompatibility to see if other people have come across it before. It's really weird, my money's more on the phone corrupting data causing the router to crash than it being the routers fault!

EDIT: I agree with Tiger on the security as well, WEP is about as secure as a wet paper bag, although as you've discovered is much more compatible!

[whiskychaser]

OK, I've got the router set to WPA2, TKIP & AES. Laptops accepted it without a problem as you would expect. The ipod still wont connect and invents its own 169... IP address again.
Cisco suggested I might get a WRT610n:
Cisco:
''It has got got DHCP reservation feature so you can reserve the ip address for IPOD and nokia''
Me: ''
Is there another Cisco product I could buy where I dont have to do that? Or is it the nature of the phones?''
Cisco:
''Yes it is the nature I am afraid,either you need to assign static ip or reserve the ip address''
My network is now more secure. Will try the static IP on the ipod again. All I need do now is send them out to find a router they can both log onto with their posh phones ;)

[Tiger]

192.168.xxx.xxx is set by your router... not Ipod or your phone...

What is your current 192.168 address? I need to know this.

Look in the Ipod and make sure you reset everything in the network side to auto.

I am determined to get yours working... just hand on. I don't use Ipod so I have to search for your solutions... have you updated your Ipod firmware? Did you talk to Apple for assistance.

ADDED... there is a new 3.1 software for your ipod touch.

[Tiger]

Change your WIFI network name and try to link your ipod and nokia to this newly named network.

Sometime there would be many identical 'linksys' name router because people are too lazy to rename it... and thus multiple routers with same name.

[whiskychaser]

192.168.xxx.xxx is set by your router... not Ipod or your phone...

What is your current 192.168 address? I need to know this.

Look in the Ipod and make sure you reset everything in the network side to auto.

I am determined to get yours working... just hand on. I don't use Ipod so I have to search for your solutions... have you updated your Ipod firmware? Did you talk to Apple for assistance.

ADDED... there is a new 3.1 software for your ipod touch.
Router IP is 192.168.1.1 (I changed it but it had no effect so I changed it back to what I can remember easily:) )
Ipod is reset to auto and has latest firmware. Havent spoken to Apple but this router does seem to be a problem on the ipod related forums. There is no danger of confusing which linksys it is - we can see a couple more routers but they have got names like 'Fred' or 'Alice' :D It occurs to me that while you might get on at say, MacDonalds, they may have no encryption whatsoever so it isnt a real test?

[Tiger]

You are also forgetting those 'hidden' routers who may be named 'linksys'.

192.168.1.1 is the worse address to use. At least go like 192.168.11.1

192.168.1.1 and 192.168.2.1 are default pathways for majority of routers. It was no effect because you were on WEP network. You are too quick to assume it has no effect.

The reason I want you to change the name is because your Ipod and Nokia 'knows' that network and set configurations to the point where you have problems.

By changing the name, you force the ipod and nokia to discover a new network and ask you what to do.

[whiskychaser]

You are also forgetting those 'hidden' routers who may be named 'linksys'.

192.168.1.1 is the worse address to use. At least go like 192.168.11.1

192.168.1.1 and 192.168.2.1 are default pathways for majority of routers. It was no effect because you were on WEP network. You are too quick to assume it has no effect.

The reason I want you to change the name is because your Ipod and Nokia 'knows' that network and set configurations to the point where you have problems.

By changing the name, you force the ipod and nokia to discover a new network and ask you what to do.
OK, changed to 192.168.11.1. I changed the SSID to 'Alisonsnores'. She wasnt very impressed but I thought it was funny:D The ipod wouldnt connect to it though. Just came up with the 169... IP address again

[Tiger]

LOL... my network name is 'SoundsFishy'... for those who I set up their routers, I always picked some silly names.

Alright... the Ipod picked up 169.192.11.3? Okay... and no connection... alright, now I can eliminated router conflicts... now let me liook into your router manual for something to turn off...

[Tiger]

Okay next step... go into your router and go to:

Wireless QoS... disable WMM.

[Tiger]

2nd try is when you selected WPA... is it WPA or WPA2?

Go for the WPA2-PSK (Personal)


Add: Reminder DHCP is on
router address is 192.168.11.1
Wireless channel... try channel 8.

In Advanced Wireless menu:
AUthentication... select Shared Key... or Open... but don't use auto... to see if ipod like this config better.
Basic Rate set to "ALL"
Secure Easy Setup: Disable.

[whiskychaser]

2nd try is when you selected WPA... is it WPA or WPA2?

Go for the WPA2-PSK (Personal)


Add: Reminder DHCP is on
router address is 192.168.11.1
Wireless channel... try channel 8.

Yep WMM is disabled. Ive got it on WPA2 Personal. DHCP on. Router 192.168.11.1. The ipod has some sort of graph feature that shows channel 6as a high peak so I tried that first. Then I did all 1-13 to be thorough. It made no difference. (The woman next door is also called Alison so I thought it best to drop the 'snores' bit out of the SSID) Maybe next step is call the manuf. and ask what router they recommend?

[Tiger]

Try a cheap D-Link router... The more generic the router, the better you are off. However, buy a good brand. I don't like SMC router... a bit of hit or miss there. I have US Robotics and it is pretty nice. Wireless G router is all you need. I don't think you need to spend any more than $40US for a G router.

You don't have any other spare router? A friend with a router he is not using?

Anything but a Linksys because I was looking at their features, they are too much for average folks.

[Tiger]

Check my above post again... I edited as I add some more things for you to check...

I am wondering if Easy Secure Setup is the culprit.

[bimmo_2007]

Try a cheap D-Link router... The more generic the router, the better you are off. However, buy a good brand. I don't like SMC router... a bit of hit or miss there. I have US Robotics and it is pretty nice. Wireless G router is all you need. I don't think you need to spend any more than $40US for a G router.


+1
I am suspecting that you have a compatability issue between your router and the phones. D-Link is compatable with almost everything.

[LunatiC]

Thanks for the responses Gents. And in a language I can understand:)
So Lunatic, mind me asking what router you are using? might just give it a try

Not that it matters much now (sorry, haven't been onto the forums for a couple of days now), but I used to have a Linksys WRT64G (note not the 'S' model) connected to an ancient D-Link DSL504T modem configured in bridge mode.

The modem kept shitting itself every time there was a power surge or blip over the electricity lines, and my Linksys was just a wireless access point + router (need the modem bit to get DSL!) so I replaced the whole lot with a Billion BiPAC 7300N, which is a modem my ISP recommended. I wanted to get an all-in-one device as I was sick of resetting both devices whenever one or the other pooed its pants.

With either setup, I never had an issue to connect my iPhone (which is essentially a glorified iPod anyway) to my network. Having said that, neither did I have any issues connecting any of my Wifi-enabled devices, including my Mac mini, MacBook Pro, PowerMac G4, my sister's MacBook or my custom-built PC running Debian and having an ASUS USB Wifi dongle on the back. This is for both the Linksys and the Billion.

At work we have an Apple Airport Express, where it too has no issues when I'm connecting my iPhone to. The only network I can't seem to connect to properly is my fiancé's D-Link wifi + router, where it exhibits the same issues that you mentioned. My fiancé's iPod Touch also doesn't want to connect to it, however her Dell laptop running Vista connects to the network via Wifi fine.

Technically I don't think the issue boils down to what brand of hardware you have installed -- it is most positively a configuration issue, or maybe a DHCP issue where you have more than one network device delegating IP addresses in the same subnet.

Yes, you could possibly solve the problem by just throwing out whatever hardware you have and plonk some cash on a new wifi router, it's more the "use a sledgehammer to drive a nail" -- it'll get the job done, but you'll never know what really was the problem.

Of course, this all depends on how much patience you have. If you don't have a lot, might as well just get new equipment.

[whiskychaser]

Maybe I should have said this at the beginning. We've got (Virgin) cable for broadband. They provide a modem and we have had no issues with it at all. My PC is hardwired to the WRT54GS. We have 3 laptops and another PC which will all connect to the router without problems. As I've put a static IP in the Nokia 5800 music, it will connect to the net via the router. I've set it to ask which access point to use so when she is out she can pick whatever is available. That really only leaves the ipod touch.
In Advanced Wireless menu:
AUthentication... select Shared Key... or Open... but don't use auto... to see if ipod like this config better.
Basic Rate set to "ALL"
Secure Easy Setup: Disable
I cant change the authentication type from auto as it is greyed out. The info says its either open or uses a WEP key but as I've got it set to WPA2 I dont think I can change this. Secure Easy Setup is set to disable. Will try changing the basic rate when her son appears.
Thanks again for all the help and suggestions!

[Tiger]

One last shot... actually two last things...

Here is a quote from a website:

When the ipod asks for your password, enter Linksys' "Encryption Key" (Accessable from the "support" tab of Linksys EasyLink Advisor) instead of the network's password. This worked for me, although I messed with the network password and all that WEP, WPA2 junk before this and it may have had some impact as well. GOOD LUCK AND DON'T GIVE UP!!

February 2, 2008 10:46 PM


Alot of those got the same router as you have G and GS makes no difference. Some reported that they did the setup like I asked you and then they re-update the firmware on the router... reset it and everything is all okay. So I suggest you give this a shot even if you have the latest firmware, reload it.


http://ipodtouchtricks.blogspot.com/2007/12/ipod-touch-wifi-troubleshooting.html

[LunatiC]

Not that it matters much now (sorry, haven't been onto the forums for a couple of days now), but I used to have a Linksys WRT64G

Just thought I'd point out that I meant a WRT54G, not a 64G.

[whiskychaser]

Just thought I'd point out that I meant a WRT54G, not a 64G.
Suppose it comes with seeing what you expect to see - I read it as 54. I should be more careful:D
Will be sure to post when I find the solution. Thanks all