535 is eating batteries

[bugger me its bust]

Any help with this gratefully accepted, my 1989 E 34 535 i has taken to discharging the battery overnight, draining it to zero volts, the battery is a new Yuassa correct heavy duty one, every now and then it does this, I have but an ammeter inline and monitored it for several hours and never seen more than 1 amp drain at any time. I have tried removing the wires from the alternator and still it will drain the battery overnight, no fuses are blowing, nothing appears to be running. Any ideas ?

[shogun]

this might help
http://www.bimmernut.com/forum/5-series-bmw/15085-battery-drain-data-individul-components.html

[whiskychaser]

IIRC Bentleys says around 0.1A is normal and above 0.5A needs investigating. FWIW, I get 0. I'd hook up the meter in line on amps range then pull fuses to see when it stops ditching power. In my experience, radios are good at draining batteries even if they are switched off but dont let that distract you

[bugger me its bust]

Thanks for the info and help with this, as I said before after things have settled down the draw of power is below 1 amp, and all seems fine but once in a while the battery becomes fully discharged overnight, given the size and capacity of the battery it must be one hell of a load to drain it down in a short time, its making the running costs in batteries expensive, I have already had one changed under warranty its unlikely this one will be given the same benefit, if it continues without getting resolved I can see myself having to scrap her, thanks again.

[shogun]

way too much, sleeping mode 30-50 mA is alright.

Typical suspects are heater valves and IHKA.
Heater valves: I assume you have the IHKA AC system with the control panel like this
http://bmwe32.masscom.net/johan/ihka/panel_temp_sensor.jpg
before you stop the engine, switch the driver side temperature control to maximum heat, over a small resistance. This is the emergency heating, that overrides also the passenger side setting and the heater valves are fully open = without power. Or disconnect the plug from the heater valve, same effect.
If that helps, you found the problem, heater valves are always on, even when engine is off.

Next is the IHKA control modul, that has in total 4 plugs, 2 on the right side, 2 on driver side. You can unplug for example 2 on one side for one night and test, next night, the other 2.
Pinout of the IHKA control module
http://bmwe32.masscom.net/johan/ihka/control_unit_1.jpg
http://bmwe32.masscom.net/johan/ihka/control_unit_2.jpg
white connector X610 'A'
1-4 stepper motor fond area
5 heater sword
6 aux fan
7 rear window heater relais
8 climate control relais
10 NC
11 NC
12+F20 (30)
13+F20 (30)
14 - 17 stepper motors for air distribution (recirculation)
18 light switch LED
19 light switch LED
20 TXD
21 water valve left side
22 aux water pump relais K8
23 water valve right side
24 front window heating relais K8
25+F20 (30)
26+F20 (30)

Blue connector X613 "C"

Pins are in such way
13 up to 1
26 to 14

1= ground
2=ground
3= NC
4=temp feeler driver side
5= potentiometer blower motor
6= temp feeler in engine room
7=outer temo feeler
8= potentiometer temperatur driver side
9=NC
10+,11+, for stepper motors
12+F21 (15)
13+ F21 (15)
14= ground
15=ground
16= potentiometer+ feeler ground
17= potentiometer flappers
18 temp feeler left
19 starter (50)
20=potentiometer+feed
21 temp feeler inside
22 temp feeler reight side
23+ for stepper motors
24+for stepper motors
25+26 = F21 (15)
26+ F21 (15)


green X611 „B“
1 to pin 14,15,16
2,3,4,5 mixing flap motor left
6,7,8,9 fresh air stepper motor outside
10 NC
11 NC
12 NC
13 NC
14, 15,16 with pin 1 legroom stepper motor left
17, 18, 19, 20 defrost flap stepper motor
21, 22, 23 fresh air stepper motor left
25 NC
26 NC

yellow connector 614 „D“

1,2,3,4 legroom stepper motor right
5 MPX button
6 MPX button left
7 MPX defrost
8 MPX button right
9 speed signal
10 RDX
11 button rear window defogger/defroster
12 MPX button recirculation
13 MPX button aircon
14, 15, 16, 17 fresh air stepper motor right
18, 19, 20, 21 mixing flap stepper motor right
22 NC
23 NC
24 NC
25 NC
26 NC

The connectors are:
13 12 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1
26 25 24 23 22 21 20 19 18 17 16 15 14

See the connectors, they are marked with small numbers outside

The the heater sword, if your car has it

the SWORD has a 5 pin connector

Pin 1 connector for the potentiometer for speed regulation at the control panel.

Pin 2 power supply

Pin 3: the relay get's contact when the blower fan potentiometer is adjusted, 12 volts come on.

Pin 4 is ground

Pin 5 the cable/wire from the blower fan.

Remove the plastic covers from the sword and connect it again to the control panel.
Use a multimeter to test it.
When you turn the thumbwheel at the potentiometer, the voltage at pin 1 changes from 1.1 - 4.25 volts. As the transistor, which amplifies the potentiometer, only has a voltage (input) of 5 volts, that should be the full power of adjustment.

In case the blower fan only starts at let's say 3.5 volts then the pre-amplifier IC (I think it is IC LM 139) is defective. There are 2 pre-amps installed. Cost around 2 $ if you do it yourselves.



BMW E34 Website (http://www.bmwe34.net/E34main/Maintenance/Electrical/Sword.htm)

[Tiger]

If you have any aftermarket stuff... disconnect them to see if that lowers the draw. Sounds like you only got an analog multimeter... go get a digital one.

[whiskychaser]

Just re-read the original post and something is wrong here. So some thoughts:
A discharged battery should still show about 11.9V and not zero. If it is indeed zero, it will not come back from the dead
Is the electrolyte cloudy? Have you checked the SG reading in each pot?
It occurs to me that if you have, say, a 65 aH battery, then even if you do have a one amp discharge, it should obviously take 65 hours to discharge and not do so overnight.
Have you checked the voltage across the battery with nothing on, then with the engine running, then with the engine running, headlights, fan, hrw on etc?

[bugger me its bust]

Thanks for this info,I am going to be having a closer look at things as soon as my schedule allows, thanks again. I should also say I dont have an AC or the fancy auto facility for climate control just the regular heating controls.

[bugger me its bust]

The battery shows zero when discharged, as I said earlier it drains down to zero overnight and I mean ZERO, no volts, zilch, bugger all. When this happened before I checked the charge rate with everything running and it was charging ok, I then ran a digital ammeter in series to monitor discharge with everything switched off,once the car had gone through its regular shut down procedures the discharge was well bellow an amp more like milliamps for several hours, I duly put it all back to normal and found the next morning the battery had drained down to zero volts this was the final straw for the battery and was indeed dead, it was replaced with a new high spec heavy duty battery and all seemed fine for a few months until it started doing the same the other day.

[Tiger]

There is a possibility that your starter is at fault... random or constant... I had a starter that turns over my engine... seeemingly normal speed... engine starts no problem but my battery continue to die prematurely... won't last 2 years... until my starter died... I put in a newer used one... and the engine spins twice the speed with old battery.

Check the cranking voltage... meanign measuring the lowest battery voltage while cranking/starting engine. If it hits below 10V... you either got a bad battery or a bad starter.

Make sure you do this test with a fully charged battery. My theory is that the amperage draw during starting is too high that kills the battery.

[genphreak]

To help with your measurements, I can share my observations:

After a short drive, my 525i(M50b25)'s new DIN66 battery measures 13.95V or so between the shock tower nut and + terminal- and the same across the terminals. I believe this means it is not being charged as if there was any difference the alternator would be working to correct it. For instance, after starting the motor, it will take a while to recharge and read a near zero difference in these measurements.

I imagine that as the battery gets older, it builds up an internal resistance, causing the difference to get larger. Note: The best time to measure this is on a clear day after a long drive- not night-time when the system is being drained and the charge may not be so perfect.

If the battery is really old, it may have such a internal high resistance that the alternator will always be charging- at this point it is not long before the battery will fail on a cold morning- and probably a long time before. So on your e34, a sure sign of this is the battery voltage (when disconnected) dropping below 12V- this is danger territory as I've observed that mine will not even crank below 11.7 (connected).

1. With a fully charged battery, verify that the standing voltage (disconnected and stabilised after charging, is >12.7V). Once installed, check that (after 35s) the discharge rate is about 40mA. Mine step down from about 2.2A (interior light) to 1.2A (IHKA flaps finishing) down to 120mA (IHKA thermometer fan) and then 40mA.

However, it depends on the shutdown procedure. The above is measured by going ignition on to ignition off with the ammeter in series to the battery. I haven't measured much after a minute or so, but the issues Shogun talks about re the IHKA are becoming more common now and you should expect to do some troubleshooting.

E.g. My car has a standing drain of 60mA at standby instead of 40mA if I just connect the battery (ie do not turn the ignition on and off after connecting it).

2. What model battery do you have? A lot of people use DIN66 as its cheaper than the DIN88, but this is the minimum for a baby six e34 ONLY (eg a 2.5). Even though a DIN66 has high CCA for the size it is nothing like its bigger cousin. I find that DIN88 last longer and can turn the engine over better and is a must for the following cars: All 530, 535, 540 e34 (and 730/735/740/750 e32). If yours is not a DIN88 or equiv (eg 20kg), it is the wrong battery. You can use a DIN66; but it will have a short service life in these cars- and troubleshooting by the book might be harder as it will provide lower voltages- sometimes.

3. Previous posters are right about checking the various things. What electrical items have you touched within the month or so prior to the drain issue? Have you verified there are no incorrect connections?

4. If there is no obvious standby leak beyond 30mA and the battery is not faulty, your alternator might be the root cause: If your battery terminals are oxidised or loose the low rpm diodes might be fried. The alt does not work below 3000rpm if this is the case, so you can get intermittent bad charging and problems on short trip days.

[bugger me its bust]

The starter motor is fine it has the correct heavy duty battery the terminals are clean the charge rate is good, frankly I'm stumped by this one, normally I find my way round electrics quite well, I have done all of the usual checks and cant find an obvious fault, the car is now one step away from the scrap yard unless I can find what the cause of the problem is. As I have said before when it drains the battery down it does it over a short time and takes the battery to ZERO volts, thats one hell of a draw for a large powerful battery. Once again thanks to all for the input on this I'm sure someone will come up with a solution.

[Tiger]

Last shot is bad ground strap at the battery terminal... engine ground strap.

[bugger me its bust]

Checked all the earth straps all good.

[whiskychaser]

If a lead acid battery reads zero volts it has had it. This is what Chloride say:
Chloride Batteries : Battery Care (http://www.chloride.co.bw/battery.htm)
I dont imagine you check the SG and voltage before you go to bed every night so guess you simply have a problem that is recurring. It could be something as simple as a loose belt. What you need to know is a. Is the alternator charging correctly (if it is overcharging it will boil the battery too)? b. Is the battery holding charge? c. Is a circuit draining the battery?
If you have an OBC you can see the battery voltage without removing the back seat or opening the bonnet :-)

PS. Tiger's post about the ground strap is a good one - you cant check the strap with a DMM. You need to substitute something heavy duty - like a jump lead

[bugger me its bust]

OK so I know zero volts equals ****ed battery, but what I am saying is this I fitted the correct heavy duty yuassa battery earlyer this year all has been fine and the charge rate good the alternator good the starter motor good all earths good in fact no obvious problem and then overnight empties the battery to Zero volts overnight, thats one hell off a load to do that, I am desperate to solve this problem, it did it months ago I fitted the new battery all was well and then it did it again.

[Tiger]

Take the car to BMW dealer. We can't help without any voltage measurements.

[whiskychaser]

Take the car to BMW dealer. We can't help without any voltage measurements.
It may sound a bit brusque but Tiger puts it in a nutshell. Without any solid reference info we are as clueless as you are

[bugger me its bust]

OK guys thanks for your help with this, I was just hopeful that there may have been someone that had a similar experience and may have had the answer. I know I hav'nt been specific with volts and amps and that may have confused the issue, when I have checked current drain on the car it has always been within acceptable amounts, bearing inn mind I am looking for something that causes a large drain in a relatively short time, as far as charging goes I have checked the volts at the battery and found 13.5 volt charge and by switching on various items, lights heaters etc the voltage at the battery does not drop bellow 13.4 volts regardless of engine speed, thanks again.

[Tiger]

13.5V will NOT charge battery. What is the voltage when engine is revved and held at say 2000RPM?

[bugger me its bust]

I am not to bothered about the charge rate, as for the last few months all has been functioning well, a poor charge rate would not cause a sudden and complete discharge of the battery, the symptoms for a poor charge rate would be a slow deterioration of battery condition and a noticeable loss of performance.
Is there anything that is ambient temperature dependant on the car, its the fact that the battery that was in perfect condition and went from performing perfectly and overnight went to zero volts, as I keep saying that is a huge demand on the battery, the same fault occurred last winter and now we are in another cooler spell is what makes me wonder if its temperature dependant.

[Tiger]

what is the static charge of your battery now... with everything off? What is the current voltage.

[Tiger]

FYI. Lead Acid Battery State

While battery is under charging condition, if the measured voltage is:

15V+ Battery is in equalization charge
14.4 to 15V Battery is near full charge during charging
12.3 to 13.2V Battery is near full DISCHARGE during charging


No charge or discharge for 6 hours:
12.7V 100% charge
12.5V 80% charge
12.2V 60% charge
11.9V 40% charge
11.6V 20% charge
11.4V Full discharge


So, in order to test the battery, you will need to charge it up with a battery charger. If the battery charger will never state full charge, then most likely your battery is dead. Intelligent battery charger may be able to revive your battery. I know for sure intelligent battery charger will prolong your battery life. I have been doing this last couple of years... twice a year... us my battery charger to charge up the battery... Batteries has lasted past their warranty period by couple of years...

Acura factory Delphi battery... 6.5 years... expected is around 5 or less.
Autozone Red (2 of them)... already past the 8 years... warranty is 7 years.


You have all the information to test your battery and your charging system. There is 'no' mysterious phantom draw... only resistance that prevents the battery from being fully charged... battery ground cable or engine grand strap are the two main culprit... they may look okay... measure okay with multimeter... but the contact points may be corroded that the electrical charge cannot pass them.

Living in extreme heat or cold area also will kill batteries regardless how good you buy. Like Arizona... all batteries will die in 3 years or so. It is just the way it is.... so buy a battery with 3 years no prorate charge and you can get free battery every single time. Keep your paperworks in safe spot. If anyone is stupid enough to give you lifetime warranty on battery in those areas... and if reputable... buy it! You will save hundreds of dollars.... assuming you keep the same car. If you don't keep car for more than the expected lifespan of the battery... then don't splurge.

Cold weather change will kill any weak batteries. There is no way around it.

[whiskychaser]

It does seem a coincidence that now the weather is getting colder the problem has come back. Somebody correct me but I think the regulator is a 14V one though mine has run happily for years at 13.8. If you can bring back a lead acid battery from 0v you are a better man than I am. Is the meter reliable? The only way I would attempt to bring a dead battery back to life is to ditch the electrolyte and replace it. In the chemical business it is known as sulphuric acid 12.60 (1.26 being the specific gravity (SG)). OP, if you live in Somerset (not what the header says) then Halfords used to do a free battery and alternator check. May be worth a go?

[Tiger]

Yes, alternator regulators are 14V... but it does not mean it is 14.0V restriction. All alternator can produce 14.4V as it should. The reason for not attaining that figure is poor link... usually the ground strap is old and corrosion. It may not look like a bad wire to our naked eyes but it is in electrical term...

13.8V can charge and maintain battery. I had an old 84 Mercedes that ran at that voltage too but I had batteries that would never last past 4 years... I wasn't very knowledgeble at that time about battery condition and voltage relationship. I even changed the alternator to a new one with higher amperage... did not improve past 13.9V... It should have been the ground strap and the battery negative cable... which are both in engine compartment.

Newer car alternator can go beyond 15V... but that is not standard regulator... those are electronic regulator as set by computer. Totally differnt animal and cost 10x more... you can buy regulator for like $30 or less... but these electronic one are $300.

[bugger me its bust]

Hi, I'm back after having been otherwise engaged for a few days, I've got 2 batteries to play with both have been on slow trickle charge and were fully charged and rested to see what a overnight rest would leave them holding, 1 had 13.9 volts and 2 had 13.8 volts I fitted 1 and started the car it cranked over fine and started first time ran perfectly, I switched it off and checked the voltage across the battery whilst connected it showed 13 volts I started the car and checked the charge rate 13.7 volts across the terminals, I left it overnight and this morning it is completely dead 0 volts. This is a huge drain in a short time, in the past when I have put an ammeter in line once things have settled down the drain is low always less than amp.

[bugger me its bust]

To add to the above post, battery number 2 has gone on and I have checked the drain of power with an ammeter in line and it shows a discharge of 0.14 amps once everything has settled down, further tests are indicating that the alternator may be faulty with an intermittent fault at idle there is a charge of 13.5 volts at 2500 rpm it fluctuates and occasionally drops to 13 volts, I have already tried disconnecting the large wire on the back of the alternator overnight to see if that would make any difference to the loss of battery voltage and it still took the battery down to bugger all. I will of course be sorting the alternator out but I dont think its entirely responsible for the loss of power in the battery.

[525it92]

Do you have a fusible link? Maybe it has a short.

Great how to page for battery drain: Diagnosing A Battery Drain | MILEPOSTS Garage (Tech Tips) (http://automotivemileposts.com/garage/v3n2.html)

[genphreak]

If the battery is old, that's how some of them go- they don't wind down to zero gradually, they just hit a tipping point sometime after maintaining a sub-normal system voltage. That is why we're telling yo to look for a 13.9V running voltage- that means you're battery is not resisting charge.

I've noticed a few go all of a sudden, after maintaining sub-13.9V running voltage. Perhaps it is a bit like how the atmosphere is warming exponentially from carbon fuel abuse; the only problem is us understanding that the tipping point is hell of a lot closer than we are hoping.

Ps. I got another month or two out of my battery by roll starting each morning through the winter... thought the car was suffering an abnormal drain but it just seemed that way- the battery was actually just having trouble keeping any charge after a cold night.

Usually it is the standby drain of 30mA that takes the system from working one day and something >12.5V standing voltage to 0V after the cold of night and a little time. Perhaps for you one of your diode packs is dead- that is bound to happen if the battery terminals are not maintaining a solid connection, or if batteries are ever disconnected even for a moment whilst the engine is running, as well as from good our closest friend; Good ol' Wear!

[genphreak]

It's only a huge drain if there was any capacity in the battery. If the battery is no good, it's capacity will be much lower than you might think. If the capacity is good, the drain will take it down overnight. If you have no real drain, it could just be the temperature taking its toll.

[bugger me its bust]

It's only a huge drain if there was any capacity in the battery. If the battery is no good, it's capacity will be much lower than you might think. If the capacity is good, the drain will take it down overnight. If you have no real drain, it could just be the temperature taking its toll.

Its a new battery, and I have checked it with another of good condition, also I have just fitted a re conditioned alternator.

[genphreak]

Def the diodes are blown: 13.5V indicates minimal charge @2500rpm. What is the voltage at idle? Mine is >13.9V

ie if battery is new, should be >12.7V standing, to get .8v potential difference indicates a very low charge rate even at that engine speed.

.14A drain when, have u measured it after half an hour of turning off the engine and locking up? (window down is ok)

[shogun]

The reason for not attaining that figure is poor link... usually the ground strap is old and corrosion. It may not look like a bad wire to our naked eyes but it is in electrical term....
this just confirms it, copied:

VERY weird starting issue - solved
Car:90 735i,thread copied from 10-10-2012 till today(excerpts)

A few months ago, my car had trouble starting. Thinking it was the battery, I was getting ready to swap it and realized that battery I had needed more distilled water. Topped it off, and problem went away. (problem was, what sounded like, very weak starting - like the starter almost wouldn't turn over)

A month later, the problem returned. Only, this time, a replacement battery didn't change anything. I left it on a trickle charger for a few weeks, made sure the battery was fully charged and as soon as I tried to start it, it sounded very very week. Well, last Friday I took it to a battery place thinking they may be able to test it better. Of course, my charging system is working fine, and the battery tested good too. Shut the car off, and try to start it, nothing. It just makes a moaning sound for half a second and stops. Next thing you know, after a few tries, the starter starts smoking. Naturally, we assumed it was the starter.
I swapped it tonight, and it STILL DOES THE SAME THING! I'm at a loss here. Battery is fine and starter is good. What do I do?
--------------------
You can check the voltage at the starter motor terminal when it is cranking. This is pin 30h with a BLK/GRN wire on it. This is the actual voltage on the starter motor, rather than the battery voltage. (See pg 1240-01 in the ETM.)

Maybe there is a bad connection through the cable or the starter relay, so the starter motor is starved of voltage?
--------------------------
The cables seem to go bad and reduce voltage.
Make sure you check both positive and negative cables.

Quick electrical class

Voltage is applied and amperage is drawn so if you reduce the voltage then the amperage draw is increased. Example (just an example) if a starter motor draws 30amps at 12volt then at 6 volts it is drawing 60amps. That is quite a huge jump in amperage and more than enough to burn a starter motor out.
------------------------
Easiest way to check the voltage at the starter is by unlocking your OBC. One of the options is system voltage at that terminal. Search. "Unlock OBC" for directions and options. It is very easy to do and especially in your case worth it
-------------------------
quote "Make sure you check both positive and negative cables."

Good point! The GND strap from the engine block to the chassis could also be corroded.

You could hold the Blk meter lead on the engine block and the Red meter lead on the BLK/GRN wire, while the starter cranks. This would be the true voltage across the starter motor.

Unwanted voltage drops might be found:

1. from block to chassis
2. from charger post to BLK/GRN wire
3. From battery negative to the chassis
4. From battery positive to the charging post.

xxxx - I see that the BLK/GRN wire goes to OBC, but I do not see a Starter Voltage test function on the OBC, just a Battery Voltage function. Did I miss it?
------------------------
Any thoughts on why my starter would have smoked previously? Too much current, maybe?
-------------------------
If the starter motor is not getting enough voltage to generate enough torque to turn the engine, then it is in stall condition.

Stall causes smoke and heat in DC motors, when there is high supply current. The commutator is stuck on one segment pair and the fan is not turning. It's just a big electric heater.
--------------------------------------
Originally Posted by E32FAN
"I see that the BLK/GRN wire goes to OBC, but I do not see a Starter Voltage test function on the OBC, just a Battery Voltage function. Did I miss it?"

Isn't the system voltage taken at the starter? I was under the impression that Terminal 'R' referenced in the OBC higher functions is starter positive terminal
__________________
Lets say there is a big voltage drop over the starter. What causes that??
------------------------
@AVEC: Jeff, check out pg 0140-02 at http://www.e38.org/e32/e32_92_etm.pdf

It defines the following symbols:
30 is "Voltage Supplied At All Times" (See pg 3435-00 where X16 pins 12 & 13 are supplying 30 inside the Instrument Cluster.)
15 is "Voltage Supplied In Run or Start" (See pg 3435-00 where X16 pin 7 is supplying 15 inside the IC.)
R is "Voltage Supplied In Accessory, Run, Or Start" (See pg 3435-00 where X17 pins 3 & 15 are supplying R inside the IC.)
31 is GND

@SeanH:A big voltage drop across the starter relay is bad, because it's supposed to be a switch.

A big voltage drop across the starter motor is good - it creates torque to turn the engine over.

Each of #1 - 4 above should be a small voltage drop - 0.25 volts say. This would leave the majority of the battery voltage to be applied across the starter motor.

My guess would be a bad connection at the charging post, since others have reported troubles there. So if you measure 12V to GND at the charging post and 5V (say) at the thick Blk cable to the starter terminal while cranking, then you will want to renew the thick Blk cable.
------------------------------------------
Alrighty, did a little testing today. Voltage over the starter (the largest connection, which looks to be coming off the power charging post) and grounding on the engine - before starting it's a solid 12v, while turning over it drops to 7-8 volts.

My friend said to check over the solenoid too. However, I'm not sure which connection is which. Is the smallest wire the switch and the other larger wire the power for the solenoid, and the huge wire (which I checked) it just for the starter motor itself?
---------------------------------
OK, and what is the voltage at the charging post while cranking? Is it staying up at 11.5 - 12V range?

While cranking and making this measurement, hold the meter's Blk probe on the chassis, and then on the Block, to see if there's any difference.
------------------------
Just an update. I started comparing starting voltage when grounding to the engine and then to the chassis. It dropped more during ground to the engine. I went to go change my ground strap and noticed one of the nuts was loose. Tried the one off my other car - WOLA - all good! Put the old one back on and tightened it down - PERFECT.
Wow...the amount of time I wasted on this is insane. I think I've learned my lesson.

[bugger me its bust]

Def the diodes are blown: 13.5V indicates minimal charge @2500rpm. What is the voltage at idle? Mine is >13.9V

ie if battery is new, should be >12.7V standing, to get .8v potential difference indicates a very low charge rate even at that engine speed.

.14A drain when, have u measured it after half an hour of turning off the engine and locking up? (window down is ok)


I have now fitted the reconditioned alternator which is working perfectly, the drain once everything has settled down is 0.14 Amp, I think I may be getting somewhere with the overnight problem of losing all volts in the battery. I have just discovered that the headlight washers will occasionally run continuously when the car is parked up and locked up ( usually at night ) and that the interior light in the boot is also turning itself on ! also when its locked up, I have disconnected the washer bottle for the head lights but other than removing the bulb from the boot light cant find another way of switching it off, it runs separate from the interior lights of the car. I'm hoping that these two problems may be the reason for the battery discharge, I will connect up a spare battery over night tonight and see what happens. If its not these causing the problem I can only guess that its possessed and maybe wants thrashing with a bible.

[genphreak]

The trunk light switch is in the catch- but a damaged/frayed boot loom lie in the boot looking up under the shelf near the LH hinge- where the loom is tied to the body is where it can break/insulation wear. Sometimes the loom is damaged inside so is not visible externally- but usually is.

If 'something' is indeed running the washers, you have a problem someplace else- have you checked there is no water under the rear power distribution box (water in the wiring is nto a good thing). You will need otherwise to methodically check as has been previously suggested as there are many heaters and otehr little functions that work after lockup (stereo, windows, locks, blower) or during unlock to defreeze locks, warm seats, washers etc. Sounds complex enough to me to warrant this kind of troubleshooting.

[bugger me its bust]

The trunk light switch is in the catch- but a damaged/frayed boot loom lie in the boot looking up under the shelf near the LH hinge- where the loom is tied to the body is where it can break/insulation wear. Sometimes the loom is damaged inside so is not visible externally- but usually is.

If 'something' is indeed running the washers, you have a problem someplace else- have you checked there is no water under the rear power distribution box (water in the wiring is nto a good thing). You will need otherwise to methodically check as has been previously suggested as there are many heaters and otehr little functions that work after lockup (stereo, windows, locks, blower) or during unlock to defreeze locks, warm seats, washers etc. Sounds complex enough to me to warrant this kind of troubleshooting.

Having now confirmed that the battery is holding a charge of 12.8 volts and being charged at 14.4-14,5 volts I think I can say that there are no issues with either, also having disconnected the boot light at the switch as well as the headlight washer at the pump it seams now to be not draining the battery overnight, having said that I expect the gremlins to do their worst so I wait with fingers crossed.