The Problem is back, but different...

[KeithW '91 535i]

Now, at least the interior lights come on every time I open the doors. That's the improvement. I wrongly assumed that every time I opened the doors to check and see if the "fix" was still holding and the lights came on that I was still good to go. Initially after the attempted fix, everything DID work. This morning, the interior lights work always, but the radio code needed to be re-entered (I did it after working on the system yesterday...this is something new). My locks, windows, roof and wipers are all as they were before. You know, I really could not clean the posts and sockets for the Relay Module and General Module. Maybe still corroded a bit? Where can I get a wire brush that small to get in those small holes? Any other suggestions based on progress to date?

Keith in AZ.

[ryan roopnarine]

Now, at least the interior lights come on every time I open the doors. That's the improvement. I wrongly assumed that every time I opened the doors to check and see if the "fix" was still holding and the lights came on that I was still good to go. Initially after the attempted fix, everything DID work. This morning, the interior lights work always, but the radio code needed to be re-entered (I did it after working on the system yesterday...this is something new). My locks, windows, roof and wipers are all as they were before. You know, I really could not clean the posts and sockets for the Relay Module and General Module. Maybe still corroded a bit? Where can I get a wire brush that small to get in those small holes? Any other suggestions based on progress to date?

Keith in AZ.

i take it from reading your post that you only applied stabilant 22. im not familiar with the stuff enough to answer my question......does it specifically say that it cleans? if it doesn't, id go get some contact cleaner and use it for cleaning, then apply the stabilant. you can get it at lowes hardware (if you have them in your part of the country) or from certain napa's. i'd call to find out. radio shack for certain has the stuff, it's just that i consider that small of a container a rip off (its about 7 dollars for 1/4 can of the crc contact cleaner). harbor freight should have a metal brush for cleaning small orifaces. don't worry about the contact cleaner not being abrasive enough, the only thing i consider a more effective hands off cleaner than the crc contact cleaner is brake parts cleaner, which obviously isn't safe to use on electronics.

[Javier]

so GM is properly grounded (X5 connection to the car body, under rear seat). Also OK is ground connection to interior lights trough Relay module, (it is X495 connection to the car body). That's two; you have at least, 5 ground connections under the rear seat.

Now Windows and Central locking depends on Power protection relay, and wipers depend on Wiper relay.

Lets focus on wipers first, as soon as you turn ignition key, fuse F1 power reaches Wiper relay K11 coil, K11 is under rear seat, just besides fuse F40. just turn key, go back and pull out / push in relay, you should feel it clicking. If not, either X493 ground connection to car body is still rusted, or relay/Fuse F1 is damaged.

If K11 is OK, turn on wipers to Fast position; this does not depend on GM, but RM and K11.

If wipers do not work, pull K11 and make a jumper at the socket connections corresponding to K11 pins 30 and 87. This will by-pass K11, if wipers work, K11 should have a bad power contact. I would open it and clean its contacts.

If still does not work, let me know, will prepare some hints to debug RM and wiper lever.

What about windows and locks? (Roof is just a 5th window). They are feed trough power protection relay K15, just besides former discussed K11. Check for the clicking when pulling out / pushing in (ignition key at proper position). Clicking will confirm GM is working OK in the relay. I would go straight to make a jumper at relay socket connections corresponding to pins 30 and 87 of the relay. Test the system with the jumper in; do not stress the windows at the end of their travel. If working, fine, again, power protection relay contact may be the culprit.

If not working with the jumper in, check you feel clicking in the RM at windows or lock operation request (I mean pushing knobs or window switches). Again let me know results to further elaborate.

If these two relays (K11 and K15) are the ones you described as funny looking, then overheating may have corroded the relay socket terminals so special attention should be taken to the relays socket contacts and relays pins. Also overheating may be caused by poor contact quality inside relay, opening and cleaning/treating may be appropriate.

I know it is frustrating, but guess you are in the right track.

Javier

Edit: Radio issue does not make any sense to me.

[Javier]

think you have to carefully check relay K15, as a damaged contact in this relay may be the culprit of the weird illuminated window switches.

You already did an improvement to GM, are wipers complains the same than before, you reported OK in high speed, if ok, K11 is fine.

Javier

[KeithW '91 535i]

what you are referring to by 'X5 connection', 'X495 connection', Fuse F1, K11 Coil, etc.
Are these documented in my Bently manual wiring diagrams?

If I can understand your specific references, I will be able to kep up with you. Electrical details are not familiar to me. I am very well versed in items of mechanical nature. Please stay patient with me, I hope I am still a fast student! Many thanks for your efforts to help me with this stubborn problem.

Keith in AZ.

[KeithW '91 535i]

The interior lights sometimes come on and at that time, the locks, windows, roof are dead. Wipers working on high position only. Today, I heard the Relay Module clicking (had not heard that before) while nothing was working.
Also heard some clicking coming from the front of the car, too, but do not recall the status of the power windows, locks and roof. I have not had the windows, locks and roof plus wipers working correctly since yesterday when I had applied Stabilant to all connections. Today, I took the fuseable link totally apart, replaced the 80 amp fuse, removed the red power supply cable that is part of the fuseable link from the battery post assembly, cleaned everything and re-assembled. This car has no visible electrical connection corrosion anywhere under the seat, but very little oxidation evidence is all I can get when cleaning. Bought Radio Shack contact cleaner today and started cleaning the posts and sockets for the Relay Module. More cleaning to come....

Keith in AZ

[ryan roopnarine]

are you certain that in the period between everything working/intermittent, that a fuse didn't just blow from something wanting more than it can handle? (since everything was "working"). im not trying to sound condescending, just asking

[KeithW '91 535i]

are you certain that in the period between everything working/intermittent, that a fuse didn't just blow from something wanting more than it can handle? (since everything was "working"). im not trying to sound condescending, just asking

time that everything was working perfectly...All at the same time! So, I guess the fuses are OK. Took stuff apart again, more cleaning, reassembled, nothing works. Bought pipe cleaners with metal bristles mixed in to get in the sockets of the RM plug. My sockets for the RM are as clean as humanly possible now. Now, to read Javier's posts from today! Thanks, Pal.

Keith in AZ.

[ryan roopnarine]

know what i suspect it is? back when my car was showing early symptoms (the wipers would die), i could get them to restore operation within about 10 minutes or a restart by pounding all of the underseat relays and gm and rm. i think that you have a flaky relay that you got to restart by handling it somewhat roughly and plugging it back in.

[Javier]

Per your post, it seems interior lights are not working solid, isn't it?

The interior lights sometimes come on

Interior lights circuit is an easy one to debug, so lets understand what is going on, focusing on them.

Get access to the RM and GM, and operate the interior lights opening/closing one door. Stick your finger to RM and feel it clicking. Does it click? Every time you open or close the door? Can you positively relate the click to the door operation? if answer is yes to all questions, your problem is either ground to RM, or RM connectors contacts dirty or corroded, I took your info on a RM change, so guess relay contacts inside RM are OK.

If no clicking, make an exhaustive check on fuse F30, it feeds all relays in RM, and some central locking components on drivers door. Do not feel satisfied with a quick look at the fuse element, remove the fuse, check spade connections status, check fuse socket looking for signs of overheating or corrosion, check with a volt-meter that the fuse is passing solid power to the pin 15 of X259 connector to the Relay Module. You can stick your under load bulb tester as described in previous post, between pin 15 of X259 and ground. Bright and steady light should be there.

I included links to pictures of X259 (X258 is like X259 but white) and X332 connectors under the RM and GM, so you can identify pins. Also is included a link to the picture of the rear seat fuse box. The box is not exactly your car but will do. From there you can identify fuse numbers and RM and GM connectors location.

http://www.bimmer.info/forum/attachm...ntid=692&stc=1

http://www.bimmer.info/forum/attachm...ntid=860&stc=1

http://www.bimmernut.com/~billr/images/rear%20fuses.jpg


Just let me know your findings, to go on.

Javier

Edit: Feel it is very important to debug F30 fuse, as it has to do with every thing but high speed wipers.